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Pac12 dissolution discussion

I work in the television and media industry for one of the big 3 (Viacom-CBS, NBCUniversal, ABC Disney). I will say this (and this is my opinion based on where things are going) - linear TV is going away soon (ie cable boxes). Content will be shifted almost entirely to apps/streaming. The reasons why are another discussion, but it basically comes down to it’s much easier to track viewership numbers on your own platform than relying on Verizon/Optimum and things like Neilson which is the only true currency for selling ads because of its neutrality.

Because of this, things like carriage fees and media markets will become essentially meaningless when it comes to rights negotiations. It will be about what brands draw the biggest eyeballs. This is why the Big Ten added USC and UCLA - it was less to get BTN on LA television packages (10 years from now there will be no cable TV). They were added because there are NO bigger national brands available at the time. This is the same reason the SEC added Texas and Oklahoma.

Hence, this is the reason why the next schools the Big Ten will target are brands like UNC, Clemson, Notre Dame. Unfortunately with the ACC GOR the $$$ for court wasn’t more than the value they’d bring so those brands weren’t available, hence why they took USC and UCLA.

This is the reason why “Ga Tech having the Atlanta market” means nothing. And why Cal/Stanford for the “San Francisco market” also means nothing. The money will be with the brands, not the TV markets. Also the reason why UC couldn’t strong arm the B1G to taking Cal as a member. They are absolutely terrible in all sports and don’t really have much tradition of winning in the major sports the way other available brands do.

Does this mean eventually the leagues kick out members like RU, Wake, Vandy etc? I don’t know and I hope not for our sake, when the “NYC market” isn’t something we can bring to a negotiating table anymore. But we’ll cross that bridge when we get to it and hopefully we bring enough value (ie eyeballs to our games to sell ads $$) someday when the time comes.
The emphasis for Rutgers is growing the brand. If Rutgers can just command a small % NYC we will be in great shape. If you notice, everything from marketing to recruiting has a big New York component. We are finally at a place with enough resources to build this. I don’t think the Big Ten is going to watch us grow, only to kick us out in a few years.
 
Can't see Clemson over Florida St.....

But that reasoning makes sense and hope the RU brand grows in the meantime!!!
 
I can see the argument about content and how a conference could factor that into the equation about who to add or not.

But at the end of the day, these are universities not franchises. If one was to go down the road of content and value, how near would it be to kick out various weaker members?

I just don't see it. The Big 10 universities (the core group) have over a 100 year history with each other. They have relationships beyond the playing field. Most of them (if not all) through the Big 10 Academic Alliance have monthly departmental meetings across the entire conference. So a few schools would throw that away for an extra $20 to $50 million more in athletic revenue. Don't think so.

As I stated earlier, Ohio State had $8.8 Billion in revenue. Approximately $1.5 Billion in research funds vs $250 million in athletic revenue. University presidents know where the real funds come from.

Worse case, the Big 10 goes back to being a quaint midwestern conference with 10 to 12 schools (maybe a few more who know what their real mission is).
 
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The emphasis for Rutgers is growing the brand. If Rutgers can just command a small % NYC we will be in great shape. If you notice, everything from marketing to recruiting has a big New York component. We are finally at a place with enough resources to build this. I don’t think the Big Ten is going to watch us grow, only to kick us out in a few years.

I’d add that all the Big 10 alums living in NY and DC areas have stronger connections to their schools with RU and Maryland in. This will also apply to the LA schools.
 
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I work in the television and media industry for one of the big 3 (Viacom-CBS, NBCUniversal, ABC Disney). I will say this (and this is my opinion based on where things are going) - linear TV is going away soon (ie cable boxes). Content will be shifted almost entirely to apps/streaming. The reasons why are another discussion, but it basically comes down to it’s much easier to track viewership numbers on your own platform than relying on Verizon/Optimum and things like Neilson which is the only true currency for selling ads because of its neutrality.

Because of this, things like carriage fees and media markets will become essentially meaningless when it comes to rights negotiations. It will be about what brands draw the biggest eyeballs. This is why the Big Ten added USC and UCLA - it was less to get BTN on LA television packages (10 years from now there will be no cable TV). They were added because there are NO bigger national brands available at the time. This is the same reason the SEC added Texas and Oklahoma.

Hence, this is the reason why the next schools the Big Ten will target are brands like UNC, Clemson, Notre Dame. Unfortunately with the ACC GOR the $$$ for court wasn’t more than the value they’d bring so those brands weren’t available, hence why they took USC and UCLA.

This is the reason why “Ga Tech having the Atlanta market” means nothing. And why Cal/Stanford for the “San Francisco market” also means nothing. The money will be with the brands, not the TV markets. Also the reason why UC couldn’t strong arm the B1G to taking Cal as a member. They are absolutely terrible in all sports and don’t really have much tradition of winning in the major sports the way other available brands do.

Does this mean eventually the leagues kick out members like RU, Wake, Vandy etc? I don’t know and I hope not for our sake, when the “NYC market” isn’t something we can bring to a negotiating table anymore. But we’ll cross that bridge when we get to it and hopefully we bring enough value (ie eyeballs to our games to sell ads $$) someday when the time comes.
Thank you for giving substance to this increasingly-contentious thread. If the Jon Wilner tweet posted by @WhichReligionIsRight is correct (you never know with Wilner), then the process of moving college games to apps and streaming has already begun. I hope technophobes like me will be able to figure out how to keep watching sports!
 
Again, no flagships just premenient status in the great state of FL, of which both UF & FSU hold that distinct designation

For someone who doesn’t care about the Noles you sure spend a lot if time posting about them

Fear not though - you’re not alone

Judging by their ratings, the upcoming Ireland and subsequent Labor Day game next year, a lot of people, including the networks, care about them

Since you’ve been repeatedly proven wrong in this and every other previous exchange, I’ll make you a deal

You sit in the corner, way out yonder, and ponder to yourself “self, I wonder which religion is right?”

Meanwhile, those of us who actually follow the great game of football will continue to discuss, debate and predict where the remaining dominoes will fall

Will FSU go to the SEC? Or Will they land in the B1G?

Whichever one will suffice, but I’ll bet you a dollar to a donut they’ll make their decision (or have it made for them) well before your religious conquest concludes
You forgot the third choice. Neither.
 
I work in the television and media industry for one of the big 3 (Viacom-CBS, NBCUniversal, ABC Disney). I will say this (and this is my opinion based on where things are going) - linear TV is going away soon (ie cable boxes). Content will be shifted almost entirely to apps/streaming. The reasons why are another discussion, but it basically comes down to it’s much easier to track viewership numbers on your own platform than relying on Verizon/Optimum and things like Neilson which is the only true currency for selling ads because of its neutrality.

Because of this, things like carriage fees and media markets will become essentially meaningless when it comes to rights negotiations. It will be about what brands draw the biggest eyeballs. This is why the Big Ten added USC and UCLA - it was less to get BTN on LA television packages (10 years from now there will be no cable TV). They were added because there are NO bigger national brands available at the time. This is the same reason the SEC added Texas and Oklahoma.

Hence, this is the reason why the next schools the Big Ten will target are brands like UNC, Clemson, Notre Dame. Unfortunately with the ACC GOR the $$$ for court wasn’t more than the value they’d bring so those brands weren’t available, hence why they took USC and UCLA.

This is the reason why “Ga Tech having the Atlanta market” means nothing. And why Cal/Stanford for the “San Francisco market” also means nothing. The money will be with the brands, not the TV markets. Also the reason why UC couldn’t strong arm the B1G to taking Cal as a member. They are absolutely terrible in all sports and don’t really have much tradition of winning in the major sports the way other available brands do.

Does this mean eventually the leagues kick out members like RU, Wake, Vandy etc? I don’t know and I hope not for our sake, when the “NYC market” isn’t something we can bring to a negotiating table anymore. But we’ll cross that bridge when we get to it and hopefully we bring enough value (ie eyeballs to our games to sell ads $$) someday when the time comes.
Just a couple of quetions.
1)If the premise in your first paragraph is true, why is the PAC12 and others, including the B1G and SEC not seeing big dollars from apps/streaming?
2)Aren't the most eyeballs still located in the biggest markets? Don't the local teams almost exclusively dominate their local markets? If I am a streamer and I want the most eyeballs in Los Angeles (second largest metro area) do I take Clemson/UNC or USC/UCLA?
Please explain it to me.
 
I just want to note that UCLA and Cal are both thought of as flagships in the University of California system. In saying that, I take no position on whether Florida has more than one flagship -- I'm just saying it's possible to have more than one.
 
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I just want to note that UCLA and Cal are both thought of as flagships in the University of California system. In saying that, I take no position on whether Florida has more than one flagship -- I'm just saying it's possible to have more than one.
Technically they don’t have any flagships as that designation was replaced by “premenient” and USF joined the club in ~2018
 
Just a couple of quetions.
1)If the premise in your first paragraph is true, why is the PAC12 and others, including the B1G and SEC not seeing big dollars from apps/streaming?
2)Aren't the most eyeballs still located in the biggest markets? Don't the local teams almost exclusively dominate their local markets? If I am a streamer and I want the most eyeballs in Los Angeles (second largest metro area) do I take Clemson/UNC or USC/UCLA?
Please explain it to me.
@ScarletDave is the expert, but let me throw in one thought. The way things are now, it doesn't really matter how many eyeballs a team attracts in its home market; rather, the carriage fees the cable companies must pay increase drastically if there is a team in the home market. In other words, it really isn't essential for Rutgers to have high viewership in the New York market. Under the scenario presented by @ScarletDave, the number of eyeballs attracted by a team does matter. So the Big Ten will be asking, "does having this team increase the number of viewers significantly?" To be honest, they may ask that about their existing teams.

There is no doubt that, under any scenario, it makes sense for the Big Ten to have UCLA and USC. The question is who else will the Big Ten want in its pursuance of eyeballs.

I hope @ScarletDave will correct me if I have this wrong.
 
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Sewercuse says they're joining the B1G in the next go around.

They are on the list. The only problem for them is there are about 10 programs ahead of them that would have to say no lol. Lloyd Christmas had about the same odds of getting with Mary Swanson.


Heard another good tid bit. FSU reached out to the B1G within the last year about membership and was told they had to invest much more in research to be a consideration.
 
Technically they don’t have any flagships as that designation was replaced by “premenient” and USF joined the club in ~2018
OK, but the question is not what Florida says. It is whether the Big Ten schools think a school is a flagship. It is, as I said, possible for a state to have more than one flagship. My impression is that the University of Florida is still considered far enough ahead of Florida State that the former is considered by the outside world as the one and only flagship. But, of course, that can change. The Big Ten seems to think that part of its brand is having flagship-type institutions, and so that's what they want.
 
I don't know much about the Florida system but I doubt anyone would say there is more than one flagship in the state and that school is UF.
 
I'm not sure what to think about Fox. Fox did re-up on MLS - even with the Apple deal. MLS is producing the broadcasts for Apple TV with a GOTW also shown on Fox (different announcing crews). So maybe, Fox may be involved in a similar way for the Pac-12. In any case, I'm on record predicting the Pac-12 deal will be close enough to the Big 12/ACC deals.

 
I don't know much about the Florida system but I doubt anyone would say there is more than one flagship in the state and that school is UF.
UF was the flagship until the new law went into place

Now there’s 3 premenient universities w them, fsu and USF

UF is widely considered the best school of the 3
 
OK, but the question is not what Florida says. It is whether the Big Ten schools think a school is a flagship. It is, as I said, possible for a state to have more than one flagship. My impression is that the University of Florida is still considered far enough ahead of Florida State that the former is considered by the outside world as the one and only flagship. But, of course, that can change. The Big Ten seems to think that part of its brand is having flagship-type institutions, and so that's what they want.
That’s fair

UF has been around longer (technically not, but the co-Ed in 1947 aspect makes it so), has more money, and is more popular in state amongst sports fans
 
They are on the list. The only problem for them is there are about 10 programs ahead of them that would have to say no lol. Lloyd Christmas had about the same odds of getting with Mary Swanson.


Heard another good tid bit. FSU reached out to the B1G within the last year about membership and was told they had to invest much more in research to be a consideration.
Heard similar, and that’s been a goal since Thrasher came in and has been ramped up (along w getting AAU status) once McCoulloigh took over
 
Doubtful
FSU is a very powerful brand

There’s zero, and I mean zero, chance they’re in the ACC until 2036

Unless you think they’re going to the B12 or whatever is left of the Pac…

I wouldn't say there is no chance.

Lets say it is true that the BIG10 values buddies for the LA schools and goes for 4 of Oregon/Washington/Stanford/Notre Dame/North Carolina. With More West Coast Schools, the Big10 actually gets another window and money to offset additional teams.

If the SEC sees no threat from the BIG10 on Florida St, why would the SEC go with them? And would they go for a partner - Clemson. With all the teams already in the SEC (including Florida and South Carolina), would Clemson/FSU actually increase the pie for them? No new windows unless they go for a weekday night.

Texas/Oklahoma/Tennessee/Florida/Alabama/TexasA&M/Georgia/LSU - you have 3-4 primetime games every week. Are you really going to get FSU and Clemson to put them on a secondary channel? and if so, is that adding 70M more per team to the pie.

If the BIG10 and SEC aren't planning on destroying every other conference, and the BIG10 skips on FSU, do existing markets with no additional windows add to the pie or dilute?
 
Kidding right; no idea why the south?

Wow
Yes, you're right. There are lots of schools in the South that attract eyeballs and of course the region is growing. I can readily see UNC and the Big Ten as a match somewhere down the line. My guess, though, is that getting more West Coast schools is a higher priority and anyway the GOR agreement makes it hard for ACC schools to join right now. My guess also is that one crucial question is: what will attract Notre Dame?
 
What will attract ND is destroying the Acc.

ND is running out of places to park their Olympic sports. The B1G and the SEC will never have them as a partial member, hockey notwithstanding. That's a marriage that works for both parties equally.
 
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I wouldn't say there is no chance.

Lets say it is true that the BIG10 values buddies for the LA schools and goes for 4 of Oregon/Washington/Stanford/Notre Dame/North Carolina. With More West Coast Schools, the Big10 actually gets another window and money to offset additional teams.

If the SEC sees no threat from the BIG10 on Florida St, why would the SEC go with them? And would they go for a partner - Clemson. With all the teams already in the SEC (including Florida and South Carolina), would Clemson/FSU actually increase the pie for them? No new windows unless they go for a weekday night.

Texas/Oklahoma/Tennessee/Florida/Alabama/TexasA&M/Georgia/LSU - you have 3-4 primetime games every week. Are you really going to get FSU and Clemson to put them on a secondary channel? and if so, is that adding 70M more per team to the pie.

If the BIG10 and SEC aren't planning on destroying every other conference, and the BIG10 skips on FSU, do existing markets with no additional windows add to the pie or dilute?
It’s all about $
Lot of variables - but end of the day, nothing would surprise me in regard to B1G or SEC
I’m warming up to the B1G on a more granular level, but as of now, for football only, prefer the sec binary wise
 
Yes, you're right. There are lots of schools in the South that attract eyeballs and of course the region is growing. I can readily see UNC and the Big Ten as a match somewhere down the line. My guess, though, is that getting more West Coast schools is a higher priority and anyway the GOR agreement makes it hard for ACC schools to join right now. My guess also is that one crucial question is: what will attract Notre Dame?
Let me add that the two highest-growth states in the South, by far, are Florida and Texas. That is going to make a Florida school attractive. North Carolina and, to a lesser extent, Georgia are also growing faster than the national pace.
 
Sure man

I just told you the great state of FL removed that designation, but you’re dead set on it

All good. We can agree to disagree
No harm, no foul
Yes, and I just told you (and you agreed) that the key is not what Florida says, but what the Big Ten thinks. And I also said (and you agreed) that UF is regarded right now as the foremost institution. So, to the Big Ten, it is the flagship. Maybe the Big Ten won't care if FSU attains AAU membership, but in that case will think that, as with Callifornia, there are two flagships. But that's not the case currently.
 
They are on the list. The only problem for them is there are about 10 programs ahead of them that would have to say no lol. Lloyd Christmas had about the same odds of getting with Mary Swanson.


Heard another good tid bit. FSU reached out to the B1G within the last year about membership and was told they had to invest much more in research to be a consideration.
10 is bit generous. I'd say 30.
 
That’s fair

UF has been around longer (technically not, but the co-Ed in 1947 aspect makes it so), has more money, and is more popular in state amongst sports fans
Florida is a top tier state university on par with most Big Ten schools.
 
Sure man

I just told you the great state of FL removed that designation, but you’re dead set on it

All good. We can agree to disagree
No harm, no foul
Your position is that a bunch of elected politicians get to decide the definition of flagship school. This is about as silly as much of your other posts. I still have not figured out when you predict FSU to the BIG. Is it in 2-3 years or after they get AAU status in 7-8 years?
 
Yes, and I just told you (and you agreed) that the key is not what Florida says, but what the Big Ten thinks. And I also said (and you agreed) that UF is regarded right now as the foremost institution. So, to the Big Ten, it is the flagship. Maybe the Big Ten won't care if FSU attains AAU membership, but in that case will think that, as with Callifornia, there are two flagships. But that's not the case currently.
Maybe

Or maybe the B1G wants FSU for all of the other reasons we’ve listed

*** Spoiler alert… it’s the latter
 
Your position is that a bunch of elected politicians get to decide the definition of flagship school. This is about as silly as much of your other posts. I still have not figured out when you predict FSU to the BIG. Is it in 2-3 years or after they get AAU status in 7-8 years?
2/3 years is what I’ve heard

I’ve made no predictions, other than to pass on info I’ve been told

Will it come to fruition?

Maybe
Or maybe not

Only time will tell
 
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