Hobbs is just not a good AD
- Thread starter NotInRHouse
- Start date
Have been through this before, but that a contract that was signed in the month of November for a football coach that was originally signed via an MOU in the month of December who began work in the month of January (after waiting out a bowl game) for a football season that runs from the month of August through the month of November has guaranteed periods that go from March 1 to February 28 is yet another exhibit how bad of a deal this is for Rutgers.
Football coaches are let go the same time every year. What the heck did Rutgers need to give Ash an extra ~$750,000 for from end of whatever season he's terminated through February 28?
Carelessness or foolishness.
I think, from reading the MOA, the periods ("Contract Year") are based on the expectation that the actual contract was expected to be drafted within 60 days of the MOA being signed. But that could be speculation. You're right, it does look a little odd - I would expect a contract based on calendar year.
Similarly, Western Kentucky fired their coach after two seasons.
“The two years that Mike was our head coach, the winning percentage over those two years is the worst by any Western Kentucky head coach since 1922,” Stewart said. “You look at where we have been as a program and where we are now, we need to get back to where we were. … It's my responsibility to get us going back in the direction that we have been at. Two years is a short time frame, but I think that ultimately you have to do what's right by your players.
“I had reached a conclusion that we weren't going to turn this around. There's no guarantees in life. I mean, there's a scenario out there where we would have. Mike certainly believes we would have, and I understand and I respect that.”
https://www.courier-journal.com/sto...fires-football-coach-mike-sanford/2109312002/“I had reached a conclusion that we weren't going to turn this around. There's no guarantees in life. I mean, there's a scenario out there where we would have. Mike certainly believes we would have, and I understand and I respect that.”
OK--this is for all the Greg Schiano groupies. He was 68-67 in his tenure, 2001-11, beating up on Buffalo, Army and Navy when they were down, and some BE teams when they were down. Not a football league, remember? Beat 1 or 2 teams over the years that were ranked 24 or 25 at the time, and nondescript teams in his bowl games.
Contrast that with Gary Waters, who was 79-75, playing in what was arguably the best basketball conference during his tenure. Lost 10 or 12 games to ranked teams.
2001-2002, he was 18-11. Beat #24 Georgetown at the RAC, and then #17 UConn and #14 Syracuse, back to back at the RAC, and later beat #13 Miami at the RAC. RU was 12-16 in 2002-2003, losing to six ranked teams. Came back in 2003-2004 to go 20-13 and get to the finals of the NIT. Lost by a point to then #1 UConn at the RAC, and beat #25 Providence, plus Nova and WVU in the NIT.
2003-2004 was 10-19, with seven of those losses coming at the hands of ranked teams. Then, Mulcahy, an organization game player and shark, forced FH Jr on him, ostensibly as an assistant, but actually as HC in waiting to gather info to enable Mulcahy to fire Walters without paying the rest of his contract. The team, despite the drumfire from newcomers on the message boards, and all Hill's obvious angling, went 19-13, beat #22 Louisville, made the NIT for the third time, lost 4 games to ranked teams, and survived an abortive attempt by Mulcahy to fire Waters in mid season for getting stranded in Ohio by a snowstorm. Two seasons later, was in Miami to watch Waters' Cleveland State team knock off Wake in the NCAA's. Cleveland State had one player that got a cup of coffee in the NBA. Wake had five future NBA players, including three that started for several years.
But Greg Schiano was young, energetic, full of himself. an eastern guy. Waters was 51 when he took over, a Midwest guy who talked more about God and character than most fans were comfortable with. You can say, easier to win in basketball, and on any given night, and he lucked into a few players and he never would pay obeisance to the AAU poobahs--no question Schiano was a far better coach--but Schiano's act wore thin in the NFL. Waters was a far superior coach, and we went down the rabbit hole in the hoops program for some time after he was forced out by an incompetent AD.
Then some fans, in the wake of the downward spiral--a car salesman in FHJ who had zero human skills followed by Mike Rice who made RU a subject of jokes and Eddie Jordan and his lazy staff--some fans were upset at Pikiell, who only got the job in late Spring, for not instantly bringing in four-star recruits. Fans. So now you guys want an aging Schiano, who did not do a wonderful job with OSU's defense, to come back?
TL
Contrast that with Gary Waters, who was 79-75, playing in what was arguably the best basketball conference during his tenure. Lost 10 or 12 games to ranked teams.
2001-2002, he was 18-11. Beat #24 Georgetown at the RAC, and then #17 UConn and #14 Syracuse, back to back at the RAC, and later beat #13 Miami at the RAC. RU was 12-16 in 2002-2003, losing to six ranked teams. Came back in 2003-2004 to go 20-13 and get to the finals of the NIT. Lost by a point to then #1 UConn at the RAC, and beat #25 Providence, plus Nova and WVU in the NIT.
2003-2004 was 10-19, with seven of those losses coming at the hands of ranked teams. Then, Mulcahy, an organization game player and shark, forced FH Jr on him, ostensibly as an assistant, but actually as HC in waiting to gather info to enable Mulcahy to fire Walters without paying the rest of his contract. The team, despite the drumfire from newcomers on the message boards, and all Hill's obvious angling, went 19-13, beat #22 Louisville, made the NIT for the third time, lost 4 games to ranked teams, and survived an abortive attempt by Mulcahy to fire Waters in mid season for getting stranded in Ohio by a snowstorm. Two seasons later, was in Miami to watch Waters' Cleveland State team knock off Wake in the NCAA's. Cleveland State had one player that got a cup of coffee in the NBA. Wake had five future NBA players, including three that started for several years.
But Greg Schiano was young, energetic, full of himself. an eastern guy. Waters was 51 when he took over, a Midwest guy who talked more about God and character than most fans were comfortable with. You can say, easier to win in basketball, and on any given night, and he lucked into a few players and he never would pay obeisance to the AAU poobahs--no question Schiano was a far better coach--but Schiano's act wore thin in the NFL. Waters was a far superior coach, and we went down the rabbit hole in the hoops program for some time after he was forced out by an incompetent AD.
Then some fans, in the wake of the downward spiral--a car salesman in FHJ who had zero human skills followed by Mike Rice who made RU a subject of jokes and Eddie Jordan and his lazy staff--some fans were upset at Pikiell, who only got the job in late Spring, for not instantly bringing in four-star recruits. Fans. So now you guys want an aging Schiano, who did not do a wonderful job with OSU's defense, to come back?
TL
looks like Mac brown to Unc..smart Ads are going with proven HCs no matter the age vrs wannabe assts ,like Ash.
. Name calling again?.Hobbs blew this big time,now the program is a dumpster fire.Hes an alledfed lawyer,there was no reason to tie the sanctions to the extensions.He dropped the ball.admit it..
I would much rather have canned him and gotten a former HC in here who could at least get us to 6 wins which is not that hard with some of the soft OOCs we have lined up.
I am not really worried about Hobbs justifying it- clearly he does not even feel the need to justify keeping someone with 3 conference wins in 3 years or hold a presser.
Now with this decision, I don't see how Hobbs doesn't follow Ash out without some miracle in bball. Then again, this is Rutgers and Barchi, when it comes to the athletic dept, is totally clueless. And also, given our history the past few years, it's hard to rule out another scandal engulfing the dept.
We someone to come in with some chutzpah and say we are getting the B1G money in 2021 and we're not going to act like the worst team in the MAC for 3 years while waiting.
This is silly
Waters won
Schiano won
Ash does not win, he won 3 conference games and was blown out Buffalo and Kansas! On what planet is that acceptable?
This absurd shtick about the quality of teams Schiano beat, newsflash inherent in there is he WON games, we are not winning now.
Schiano beat MSU and Illinois and Maryland while a BE program, he beat Buffalo, he was not winless against the MAC. If we played Army or Navy this year we would have been gutted.
You really think Schiano could not have gone 3-0 in OOC and won 3 B1G games this year? Come on.
Schiano and Waters made the post season, under Hobbs we have yet to make the post season in either sport and had he had the common sense to fire Ash people would be a lot more patient, but now I'm not feeling so generous.
Not to mention another thing about Schiano
He had more conference wins than players currently housed in the Middlesex County jail
Oh yes the problems of the Schiano years, smoking joints and losing in OT to WVU, good thing those days have passed for the shining Ash era of leaving a blowout by Buffalo early and murder plots. My god Schiano was not perfect but to say he is better than we have now is the understatement of the century.
And it does not have to be Schiano, any average HC could do better on both counts.
He had more conference wins than players currently housed in the Middlesex County jail
Oh yes the problems of the Schiano years, smoking joints and losing in OT to WVU, good thing those days have passed for the shining Ash era of leaving a blowout by Buffalo early and murder plots. My god Schiano was not perfect but to say he is better than we have now is the understatement of the century.
And it does not have to be Schiano, any average HC could do better on both counts.
Hobbs is a damn asshole. Guy praises effort in his statement like this is pop warner or goddamn physical education class. It's the Big FNG Ten!!!
Chris Ash goes 1-11 in year 3 with multiple player arrests, declining attendance/season ticket sales, recruiting at MAC level, and a consistent multi-year pattern of making terrible personnel decisions and coaching hires and he gets another year to show significant improvement??? So he wins 4 games next year and gets a fifth year because he improved to 4 wins??? Is that what this program is about?
Chris Ash goes 1-11 in year 3 with multiple player arrests, declining attendance/season ticket sales, recruiting at MAC level, and a consistent multi-year pattern of making terrible personnel decisions and coaching hires and he gets another year to show significant improvement??? So he wins 4 games next year and gets a fifth year because he improved to 4 wins??? Is that what this program is about?
Another great post. Who said this wasn't a good thread. Are we gonna have people running around the stadium again with petitions crying about how we got to save Ash's job, like they have with Flood's and Julie's and of course Big Bob's? How embarrassing.
Have I missed something...does Hobbs even plan to comment on Ash coming back besides that ridiculous couple of sentences he gave to a few select members of the press? Does he think by not commenting on it somehow it was never a big deal or even concern that Ash would ever be fired. So no reaction at all from him...nothing to the fans about total failure of 1-11...radio silence. .I expect something today if not then its obvious whats going on
Nah. People would have then claimed it was the dreaded "vote of confidence" and it was a sure indication Ash would get fired at the end of the season.
I would hope not. I have always believed that once you make the decision to fire someone, you do so immediately (even if you are announcing they will continue to coach for the rest of the season, as Kansas did with Beatty). If Ash is not "the guy", a 5 or 6 game stretch with improved but still average defense should not be enough for him to keep his job. It is more likely that you are delaying the inevitable and will have no choice but to fire him at the end of next season or the year after. I think they believe Ash can get the job done here.
dude I know he is coming back... i am talking about Hobbs making a statement talking about Ash and why he is bringing him back, a vote of confidence at the end of the season. Some sort of statement for the fans not just some note to reporters. Seems like an odd way of getting information out there. Its as if Hobbs will just carry on like 1-11 didnt happen.
I don't think we are getting more than that statement. It is typical to release a statement to the press without holding a press conference. Press conferences tend to only be for when someone gets fired or hired.
how about an interview or something...even Sargeant commented how odd that phrased blurb was. Its almost as if everything is humming along...when the football program is a crapfest to but it bluntly and you are bringing back a 1-11 coach who has done zero to show that he can be a winner here, you better be doing all you can to save your fans...considering football renewals will start soon
I’m not so sure about that. Most schools, teams, franchises, have an end of year presser. It’s a big fail by Hobbs. The fans deserved to hear from him and if he truly believes in Ash he should sell that to the fans.
I wonder if Hobbs doesn't want to do it because then it sort of gives credence to the fact Ash is a disaster. Yes we all know he is but he doesn't want to go out there publically to defend him because then the questions becomes if you know you have to defend him in this manner then why didn't you just fire him. Basically it extends the conversation and opens up a can of worms that isn't needed.
good point. His lack of doing a presser or answering an individual beat reporters questions on this topic shows Lack Of Leadership on Hobbs part.
Or hold a Press Conference to somehow give a rational explanation as to why this Coach is returning for another season. With his 3 years at RU we have continually seen his teams unprepared for games, poor in game coaching, Instability in his Staff hiring,and recruiting results that no way resembles a P5 program.
Yeah, silence is correct. The Program has a solid foundation.
Nothing he would say in a press conference would satisfy the fans thirst for the firing that did not occur.
If that’s true then he’s not the media savvy leader we were told about. Look, I get it, he’s in a bad spot. The questions won’t be easy and maybe whatever he says won’t matter. But, it’s his job to at least try and convince the fans that the sky is not falling.
You know I hate to agree with him, but Hobbs has a JD from UNC and LLM from NYU, he knows how to make a bad argument somewhat better...I would even take a more detailed statement like Illinois fans got. Some hope. Anything. Instead everyone is left to guess that Hobbs is insane or can't raise the money or some combination, none of which reflects well.
He has a chance assuming some assistants are replaced (for the love of God that better happen) to at least talk about an improving defense and fixing other areas, recruiting...something. Anything. Not just praying people forget.
I agree as one too, but shouldn't Hobbs be capable of fashioning a colorable argument to the media as to what progress he's seen, expecting, changes to be made, etc.?
Looks like I was wrong. Credit to Hobbs for trying to rally things, even if the position he's taking is a bit weak now.
I'm sure Fordham Law had you go through a moot court course. (Note to non-lawyers; this is a mock oral argument before several individuals acting as judges.) So you know happens when you make a "colorable" argument: (Note to non-lawyers: a "colorable argument" is one that's not completely crazy, but not very good either.) You will be hammered by the judges questioning you. The same would happen to Hobbs. Even the best oral advocate you've ever heard of would look bad.
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