Match Thread : RU Wrestling v Ok St, 1pm, w match ups preview:
- Thread starter Abro1975
- Start date
Barely a graze when the opponent walked into a hand. Probably the most egregiously bad OT , match ending call ,
I’ve seen in 30 years. The ref was so distraught over waving off the Suriano locked hands call , I told my buds next to me, that the make up call would come within 30 seconds. I figured a stall call, not an invisible hand to the face.
That's because he wasn't called for a face slap. He was called for contacting Fix in what they are calling the "triangle" part of the face. Basically you can't touch anywhere below the forehead. It's been a point of emphasis all year. You get anywhere near the eyes and refs have been super quick to call the violation.
Let’s face it, it was a make a call for waving off the locked hands
Against Suriano. The Ref was looking at Pat Smith the entire match. He was intimidated.
Happy Hour was calling! (just kidding, Abro...I love ya buddy).
I think he’s retired now so no such thing. I think it’s just any hour now
Exactly my thoughts wngarbarini -How the heck don't you know that the call ends the match.They blew the calls and the worst way to end the match.I am dumbfounded by the refs.
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Just imagine if Glasgow was healthy - The kid beats the Oklahoma wrestler along with the Rider kid.I still think he should have not been out there today.I do not see anyone else wrestling this soon after surgery.It just does not make any sense to me.The talent is absolutely there and I only hope it pays dividends at the Big Ten tournament if he is healthy.Maybe he gets in with a couple of good wins.
No..it couldn't be explained..even if you were there it was hard to figure out what was going on. To try and explain it would be an exercise..
Sadly Suriano had 14 seconds riding time advantage. Assuming both Fix and NS each escaped in same time in the 2nd OT Nick would have won on riding time advantage. I am sure he knew that
NJ dot com has a good storyvfor those who were not there. These threads don't fill in the gaps very well for anyone looking for a summary.
https://www-nj-com.cdn.ampproject.o...ck-suriano-in-wild-controversial-ot-bout.html
The Ref was blind just like Fix for a second or two
That said I don't like this being a point, they need to change the rules to issue warnings first, and it really sucks when it decides a match.
What this doesn’t show is the STEP FORWARD Fix took immediately prior landing his face into Nick’s hand. Clearly, BOTH wrestlers looked surprised by the call, that tells you all you need to know. Absolutely terrible officiating.
Yet, the ref calls “unnecessary roughness” on Nick but let’s Willie Scott’s arm almost come out of his socket before making that “potentially dangerous” call where someone can actually get hurt, smfh. Yeah, that ref sucked.
Go RU!
Diane
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Bottom line: Point of emphasis or not, calling that penalty point is a judgment call, and you don't make that call in the regular season, in SV, against the home team, in front of a sold out basketball arena. It was a terrible call, and was terrible for the sport. This is not the NCAA tournament. Let two warriors finish on the mat, the way I am sure they both wanted to.
So I watched the NS match over and over. I have the ability to slow the match to individual frames. Here is my take:
In first ride out in OT it is clear Fix lock hands. I wish I can post pics. Goody made the right call which we lost.
Second ride out when okie called locked on NS it was on a mat return and NS is legal do that and clearly released before mat return which we were not penalized.
The hands to the face. During the match they both went to the head a lot. But No face hits. When NS was called Hands to the face it was clearly on Fix’s Face in his eyes. So the rules are the rules.
That being said. I don’t believe the ref should of made that call. Two studs fighting for position you don’t call that and let that the wrestlers decide the match.
Let them Wrestle. JMO!!!!
What I will say I was disappointed in both wrestlers lack of offense. But when you have two great wrestlers no one wants to make a mistake.
Just telling like I see it. I was there tonight. Got to see some good friends. Crowd was great except the throwing of the water bottle. We are passionate about our team. No need for that. Go RU Wrestling!!!!
In first ride out in OT it is clear Fix lock hands. I wish I can post pics. Goody made the right call which we lost.
Second ride out when okie called locked on NS it was on a mat return and NS is legal do that and clearly released before mat return which we were not penalized.
The hands to the face. During the match they both went to the head a lot. But No face hits. When NS was called Hands to the face it was clearly on Fix’s Face in his eyes. So the rules are the rules.
That being said. I don’t believe the ref should of made that call. Two studs fighting for position you don’t call that and let that the wrestlers decide the match.
Let them Wrestle. JMO!!!!
What I will say I was disappointed in both wrestlers lack of offense. But when you have two great wrestlers no one wants to make a mistake.
Just telling like I see it. I was there tonight. Got to see some good friends. Crowd was great except the throwing of the water bottle. We are passionate about our team. No need for that. Go RU Wrestling!!!!
So, you would rather that a call like this determine a national champion? On Saturday night in March, this same match is taking place, and you want Nick to lose on a hands to the face call? Really?
I think you want this call in a huge in-season match like this to bring it to the NCAA's attention, so that they can see how stupid it is, and so that they can make an adjustment now, rather than have a national championship match decided like this.
A lot of people have mentioned this, but you have to keep in mind there is constant movement, level changes, half shots....etc throughout every match. Generally speaking, if this were a legitimate defense, the violation would never be called because every coach would just argue the opposing wrestler's movement caused the foul.
It's useful to think of this along the lines of the penalty NFL defensive players get when they hit the head/neck area of an opposing offensive player. No matter what type of movement the offensive player does (i.e., lowering their head to brace for impact), its incumbant on the defensive player to avoid the head/neck area, no matter what.
Having said that, the officiating in this match was a total cluster fluffle. No doubt about that.
Same claims of BS would be said by your PSU faithful on all that we are saying here but of course in the land of Blue and White you guys sh*t roses. We aren’t happy with offense but you don’t make that call. Period.
I agree that having this call will hopefully bring light to the subject being a problem but only if it was blatant.
Understood, but it certainly goes to determining if it was flagrant or with mal-intent. Certainly wasn’t. What about that poke in the eye to Correnti (I believe it was him). EDIT: IT WAS COLUCCI. Why wasn’t that called then? That wrestler was hitting the head.
Go RU!
Diane
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Intent or flagrancy doesnt factor into the enforcement of this particular rule. As to Correnti, I'm not sure. Must have missed that. However, I did see a blatant eye poke in Joey McKenna's (Ohio St. vs. Michigan St.) match today that went completely uncalled. Sometimes refs just completely whiff.
The following was posted on BWI on November 5.
"Supposedly, all college refs have been informed that a major point of emphasis this year is hands to the face. Wrestlers are allowed to put their hands on an opponent's forehead. However, there is basically a triangle between the eyebrows and the chin. If a wrestler puts his hand in the triangle area of an opponent while on their feet, there is not supposed to be any warning -- the ref is supposed to stop the action and award a point to the wrestler whose opponent placed their hand in the face triangle area.
Per the college ref, the college ref community has also been informed that if they do not enforce this point of emphasis, they will lose assignments. In short, this truly is a major point of emphasis."
So, the NCAA appears to have taken subjectivity out of it. Either the hand was in the face or it wasn't. Intent doesn't matter. Force doesn't matter. Slipping doesn't matter. Blatant or not doesn't matter. Make the call, or you're losing good reffing gigs.
Yes, it is stupid. But, it was called exactly how the NCAA wants it called. Your issue should be with them and zero offense in 11 minutes.
Well, we’ll be watching to see if ALL the refs are now making those calls for EVERY program.
NOW that it has affected an RU kid you're going to be watching? Maybe be concerned about the direction of the sport, not just one incident with your team.
There was one called against PSU Friday night against Northwestern. Don't remember the match, but I can try to figure it out, if you're interested. And, Brady Berge, one of PSU's 149s, was tied near the end of his Southern Scuffle semi-final, and got hit with it, so the match didn't go into OT. I've seen the call a lot this year. You've probably seen it, too, just not under these circumstances.
The other thing I'm seeing is kids being very cautious when reaching for the collar tie, exaggerating the reach around the neck, instead of just a straight reach.
I'm a little bit surprised that so many on this board weren't even aware that it was a point of emphasis this year. This is an off year for rule changes, since they make actual rules changes on a semi-annual basis. In the opposite years, they make points of emphasis for existing rules.
It is such a huge point of emphasis that it hasn't been called once in any of our matches
Correct my issue is with offense and the NCAA (and the refs). As an observer of Heil against AA it would drive me insanely nuts to watch him win while literally doing nothing but defending. But the guy won. Felt that same way last night and neither wanted to go out to shoot and take it. Both of them were not wrestling to win and rather wrestling to not lose. There is a difference. Hope it changes NS for the better come March.
Point of Emphasis on the hands to the face with NCAA wrestling from Secretary Rules Editor Chuck Barbee
November - 2 - 2018
Dear wrestling media members,
I hope the 2018-19 wrestling season is starting off well for you. I am writing to remind you of the NCAA wrestling rules resources that are available on the Wrestling Rules Committee webpage: http://www.ncaa.org/playing-rules/wrestling-rules-game .
This is a non rules change year so there are no new rules to implement, however, the committee has numerous points of emphasis for the season. Probably the most important POE for you to be aware of is the calling of unnecessary roughness when a wrestler deliberately places their hand in, on or around the eyes nose and mouth. Questions regarding this POE can be found in the NCAA Wrestling Case Book under AR 5-44, 45 & 46. Please share this resource page freely with your writers, commentators and any other appropriate individuals.
If you have any questions, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Chuck Barbee
Chuck Barbee
NCAA Wrestling
Secretary-Rules Editor &
Weight Management Liaison
https://www.nationalwrestlingmedia....ing-from-secretary-rules-editor-chuck-barbee/
November - 2 - 2018
Dear wrestling media members,
I hope the 2018-19 wrestling season is starting off well for you. I am writing to remind you of the NCAA wrestling rules resources that are available on the Wrestling Rules Committee webpage: http://www.ncaa.org/playing-rules/wrestling-rules-game .
This is a non rules change year so there are no new rules to implement, however, the committee has numerous points of emphasis for the season. Probably the most important POE for you to be aware of is the calling of unnecessary roughness when a wrestler deliberately places their hand in, on or around the eyes nose and mouth. Questions regarding this POE can be found in the NCAA Wrestling Case Book under AR 5-44, 45 & 46. Please share this resource page freely with your writers, commentators and any other appropriate individuals.
If you have any questions, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Chuck Barbee
Chuck Barbee
NCAA Wrestling
Secretary-Rules Editor &
Weight Management Liaison
https://www.nationalwrestlingmedia....ing-from-secretary-rules-editor-chuck-barbee/
Ah, good point about Heil. His allowing a shot, then diving for an ankle and holding on for a stalemate led to an actual rule change. The new (as of last year) danger position swipes, leading to a TD awarded were instituted almost exclusively due to him. That is one the NCAA got right, as the rule has led to more action from guys close to that position. Hands to the face? Not so much.
So, you've watched every match your guys have wrestled? And, if it hasn't happened, the refs should just make it up, because it's a point of emphasis? Okay.
I stated before years ago 200 people watched Rutgers wrestling and yesterday was over 8,000.So what comes with that are more people that don't understand the rules or people who only watch Rutgers wrestle.Nobody likes the way the match ended but a rule is a rule and everyone who follows the sport closely knows that this has been called across the country over and over and over this year.I hate the rule and think it's gonna put a huge black eye on our sport on Saturday night when a NCAA title is decided by a hands to the face.Multiple matches at the NCAA tournament will be decided by hands to the face.I have been to multiple opens this year and have seen numberous matches decided by hand to the face
How come both Correnti and Glasgow didn't take bottom? It seems they each left one point on the mat by choosing neutral.
Correnti because Geer best position is top.And Glasgow I would guess because of the knee and Shomers best position is also top
I think we all agree that the NCAA put the refs in a horrible situation this year and it needs to be addressed like ASAP. Imagine if this was a semi final or championship bout.
Time to move on. Suriano needs to shoot and take the match on his own. Wrestle cautious for 7 minutes and you ask for the refs to take it.
Time to move on. Suriano needs to shoot and take the match on his own. Wrestle cautious for 7 minutes and you ask for the refs to take it.
