OT: PGA and LIV Golf to merge….

[MADHAT1]

The Mexico LIV event was a joke. People wouldn’t go for free.

Most golf fans would rather see unknowns like Knapp play lights out and win a PGA event than see Ian Poulter spraying it around some average course.

Unknowns become the ones the public follows once they establish themselves.
When the stars fade into oblivion and their games are only a fond memory , there are always players that step into the limelight taking their place as tour favorites .
The stars that jumped to the LIV will be missed, but only for a short time because the tour will have some of the players mentioned in article below make a name for themselves and become fan favorites while those who jumped to the LIV lose most their following to the tour's new faces
( some of the players mentioned in article might wind up in the LIV, pulling in the bucks but not a large fanbase like the tour players will be able to if they play well enough to be noticed )
Ranking the top 20 potential breakout stars of 2024 - NBC Sports
https://www.nbcsports.com/golf/news...l-breakout-stars-of-2024-in-professional-golf

 

[jtung230]

History agrees with you.

Ben Hogan
Arnie Palmer
Jack Nicklaus
Lee Trevino
Johnny Miller
Tom Watson
Greg Norman
Fred Couples

The most popular players came and went. Phil is now an afterthought. Who talks about DJ or Bryson anymore? Tiger? Yes he'll never be replaced and Rahm hurts for now but they'll be others to challenge and replace Spieth, Thomas, Fowler, Finau and the rest in populariry.

PGA tour legends. Don’t think there will be any LIV tour legends. Phil, DJ and BD will all be remembered for their accomplishments on the PGA tour only.

 

[Section124]

The Mexico LIV event was a joke. People wouldn’t go for free.

Most golf fans would rather see unknowns like Knapp play lights out and win a PGA event than see Ian Poulter spraying it around some average course.

I am going to disagree with that. You are correct the Mexico crowd/event was a joke but the PGA event there gets no crowd either. I watched that one on TV and was happy to finally watch a golf tournament where I knew the top half of the leaderboard. Every time I turn on a PGA event now I know 1 or 2 in contention. That is a big negative on the tour right now. LIV may not be for everyone but it's growing on me...outside of the leader announcer...packaged within 4 hours so I see a ton of golf shots. Having the soccer guy from Ted Lasso leading the broadcast doesn't help.

 

[Section124]

This is what watching the PGA Tour looks like this year.

 

[jtung230]

This is what watching the PGA Tour looks like this year.

View embedded media

And LIV is better



Good thing no one watches because that could’ve really hurt someone.

 

[Caliknight]

Anthony Kim being thrust into a tournament after not playing competitive golf is just so LIV. Guy hasn't played in 12 years and looks like a washed up drug addict slob. And has the game to match. What an embarrassment.

None of those guys will ever win a major while playing on that tour. It's simply not serious golf.

It's sort of golf. But louder.

 

[WhiteBus]

None of those guys will ever win a major while playing on that tour. It's simply not serious golf.

Brooks Koepka says hello.

 

[Section124]

And LIV is better

View embedded media

Good thing no one watches because that could’ve really hurt someone.

But it means more on the PGA Tour. 😀

 

[Section124]

Bruce Koepka says hello.

Bruce? 😀

 

[jtung230]

Bruce? 😀

Bruce is also the one that wanted to jump back to PGA. He was very candid about why he joined LIV.

ETA Bruce and Gary Schiano should hangout

 

[MADHAT1]

Bruce? 😀

once they leave the PGA, it's only a matter of time before they start o lose name recognition .😉
No one follows Blll Mickelson anymore , well maybe his bookie 😮

 

[WhiteBus]

Bruce? 😀

Seems my phone doesn't like the name Brooks. Like Brooke, Bruce better. Also doesn't like Bryce even though I've typed it over 100 times on the Phillies thread. That auto corrects to Bruce as well.

 

[knightfan7]

This is what watching the PGA Tour looks like this year.

View embedded media

Former Illini golfer Thomas Detry. He was last after 2 rounds. Even if he made the Par instead of a Quad, he would have missed the cut by 5 strokes.

All in all he's having a good season. Top 30 in FedEx standings.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Rory starting to panic, ratings tanking:

McIlroy: Golf unification deal needs to 'speed up'

Pointing to a ratings dip this season, Rory McIlroy said Wednesday the deal between the PGA Tour and Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund needs to "speed up."

www.espn.com

 

[Section124]

I still don't understand how Monahan has a job. Also read another article about Rory and Brooks being best friends. These guys just want to play together. PGA Tour needs to get a deal done ASAP. I actually watched the LIV replay over the API. Much better tournament since Scottie destroyed the field.

 

[ClassOf02]

Hopefully people are starting to realize that the only thing happening right now is that popularity of professional golf is dwindling. I consider myself an avid golf enthusiast when it comes to playing and watching the pros, and I haven’t spent more than 30 minutes watching anything so far this year. I will pay more attention this week given it’s the Players, but usually I’d be dialed into Pebble, Rivera, Bay Hill, etc. Not so much this year.

 

[WhiteBus]

Hopefully people are starting to realize that the only thing happening right now is that popularity of professional golf is dwindling. I consider myself an avid golf enthusiast when it comes to playing and watching the pros, and I haven’t spent more than 30 minutes watching anything so far this year. I will pay more attention this week given it’s the Players, but usually I’d be dialed into Pebble, Rivera, Bay Hill, etc. Not so much this year.

It's been a horrible season so far. The star players have stunk this year so far until last week.

 

[Ty Webb]

Ratings were down for The Players Championship, which continues a trend of disappointing viewership numbers for the Tour.

However, the viewers lost are not exactly running to LIV to watch either, who has seen a minor uptick in viewership. They just simply aren't watching golf at this point.

And that's a problem for both tours. Something has to get figured out soon. Some players met with Yassir yesterday in the Bahamas (quite the life that dude has - rich beyond anyone's wildest dreams, flies all over the world just playing golf, etc.).

Maybe in a few weeks we'll find out what, if anything, transpired there.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Ratings were down for The Players Championship, which continues a trend of disappointing viewership numbers for the Tour.

However, the viewers lost are not exactly running to LIV to watch either, who has seen a minor uptick in viewership. They just simply aren't watching golf at this point.

And that's a problem for both tours. Something has to get figured out soon. Some players met with Yassir yesterday in the Bahamas (quite the life that dude has - rich beyond anyone's wildest dreams, flies all over the world just playing golf, etc.).

Maybe in a few weeks we'll find out what, if anything, transpired there.

SS may of the best player in the world (or second behind Rahm), but he is plain as vanilla. Boring.

 

[jmc11201]

Ratings were down for The Players Championship, which continues a trend of disappointing viewership numbers for the Tour.

However, the viewers lost are not exactly running to LIV to watch either, who has seen a minor uptick in viewership. They just simply aren't watching golf at this point.

And that's a problem for both tours. Something has to get figured out soon. Some players met with Yassir yesterday in the Bahamas (quite the life that dude has - rich beyond anyone's wildest dreams, flies all over the world just playing golf, etc.).

Maybe in a few weeks we'll find out what, if anything, transpired there.

PGA is in a weird spot. If they can wait out LIV, at some point LIV will have to concede defeat.

I would imagine LIV revenues include TV, ticket sales, sponsors, and merchandise. On all fronts, LIV trails the PGA. Yet LIV pays the golfers more. If the PGA can't afford to pay what LIV pays, there is no way LIV can afford to pay what LIV pays from LIV revenues. At some point the Saudi's will throw in the towel if it doesn't get any real traction.

For many people, the majesty of golf is in the history and the pace of the tournaments. LIV doesn't feel interesting or meaningful to me...or obviously many others.

 

[jtung230]

Ratings were down for The Players Championship, which continues a trend of disappointing viewership numbers for the Tour.

However, the viewers lost are not exactly running to LIV to watch either, who has seen a minor uptick in viewership. They just simply aren't watching golf at this point.

And that's a problem for both tours. Something has to get figured out soon. Some players met with Yassir yesterday in the Bahamas (quite the life that dude has - rich beyond anyone's wildest dreams, flies all over the world just playing golf, etc.).

Maybe in a few weeks we'll find out what, if anything, transpired there.

Sunday’s final round of The Players Championship averaged a 2.45 rating and 4.14 million viewers on NBC, up 38% in ratings and 42% in viewership from last year (1.8, 2.91M) and the top sporting event of the weekend. (The NCAA Tournament Selection Show was the top sportscast overall with 5.1 million.)

 

[jtung230]

SS may of the best player in the world (or second behind Rahm), but he is plain as vanilla. Boring.

Rahm was 3rd when he left. But facts are hard in this thread.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Rahm was 3rd when he left. But facts are hard in this thread.

Only majors matter.

 

[jtung230]

Only majors matter.

Ok, he won 2. Almost caught Speith.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Ok, he won 2. Almost caught Speith.

Nice try. Speith wins were a long, long, long time ago. Try to stay current old man. At least you didn't try to use Rory as an example. LOL!

 

[jtung230]

Nice try. Speith wins were a long, long, long time ago. Try to stay current old man. At least you didn't try to use Rory as an example. LOL!

What’s recent? Rahm won 1 last year. Scottie beat 2 of the major winners last year to win the Players. I guess Rahm is as good as Clark and Harman.

 

[Caliknight]

SS may of the best player in the world (or second behind Rahm), but he is plain as vanilla. Boring.

He’s better than Rahm. The longer these guys stay in the hinterlands of LIV golf the more their games will deteriorate. It’s just not serious golf and no one see them.

 

[knightfan7]

He’s better than Rahm. The longer these guys stay in the hinterlands of LIV golf the more their games will deteriorate. It’s just not serious golf and no one see them.

I agree with this. Well, other than Koepka.

How's your game? All over the physical issues?

 

[Ty Webb]

Sunday’s final round of The Players Championship averaged a 2.45 rating and 4.14 million viewers on NBC, up 38% in ratings and 42% in viewership from last year (1.8, 2.91M) and the top sporting event of the weekend. (The NCAA Tournament Selection Show was the top sportscast overall with 5.1 million.)

That's last year's ratings. Read the date on top of whatever report you pulled that from. This was from Sports Media Watch just earlier this week:

Placing third, final round coverage of The Players Championship golf tournament averaged a 2.1 and 3.53 million on NBC — down 16% in ratings and 15% in viewership from last year (2.5, 4.14M). All four rounds of play declined from a year ago.

The PGA has a viewing problem but that only tells half the story. The other half is that viewers aren't bailing the PGA to go watch Rahm and Koepka and others on LIV. They just aren't watching golf with the game fractured. That's a problem for both tours.

 

[Ty Webb]

PGA is in a weird spot. If they can wait out LIV, at some point LIV will have to concede defeat.

I would imagine LIV revenues include TV, ticket sales, sponsors, and merchandise. On all fronts, LIV trails the PGA. Yet LIV pays the golfers more. If the PGA can't afford to pay what LIV pays, there is no way LIV can afford to pay what LIV pays from LIV revenues. At some point the Saudi's will throw in the towel if it doesn't get any real traction.

For many people, the majesty of golf is in the history and the pace of the tournaments. LIV doesn't feel interesting or meaningful to me...or obviously many others.

The problem is LIV doesn't appear to be ready to concede anything and could drag on for years. That would be an issue for the PGAT, especially if they bleed a few more highly recognizable players to LIV, which is possible. I think the way the PGA has gone about the whole merger (announcing out of the blue, etc) rubbed some guys the wrong way and if things keep going like they are going, they may just throw their hands up and take the cash.

There's no question LIV isn't "successful" from a production standpoint. Their events aren't well attended. Their ratings are low (and misleading). They have no major sponsors. Teams have cut sponsorship/apparel deals but with 2nd and third tier companies. They survive because the PIF funnels cash to them. That's it.

But the PIF could do this for a decade if they want and I just don't think the PGAT could hang on that long.

But there is also another underlying issue here. I don't think the LIV format really interests people. So if they become the dominant tour by suffocating the PGAT, they could have a viewership problem themselves. And if the model is to sell team franchise rights, try doing that with low ratings and decreased TV revenues.

The whole situation is actually kind of fascinating at this point. One tour has the prestige, the sponsors, the TV deals, the courses and cash flow. The other just has an endless pile of cash. Who, if any, wins?

 

[jtung230]

That's last year's ratings. Read the date on top of whatever report you pulled that from. This was from Sports Media Watch just earlier this week:



The PGA has a viewing problem but that only tells half the story. The other half is that viewers aren't bailing the PGA to go watch Rahm and Koepka and others on LIV. They just aren't watching golf with the game fractured. That's a problem for both tours.

My Google skills are terrible 😀

ETA I think golf got a big lift from COVID. But like everything else, it will revert back a bit.

 

[T2Kplus20]

What’s recent? Rahm won 1 last year. Scottie beat 2 of the major winners last year to win the Players. I guess Rahm is as good as Clark and Harman.

Nobody cares about the Players. Majors or bust.

 

[T2Kplus20]

That's last year's ratings. Read the date on top of whatever report you pulled that from. This was from Sports Media Watch just earlier this week:



The PGA has a viewing problem but that only tells half the story. The other half is that viewers aren't bailing the PGA to go watch Rahm and Koepka and others on LIV. They just aren't watching golf with the game fractured. That's a problem for both tours.

+1
Very bad for the sport. Only a deal will save golf. Let players play whatever they want. The solution isn't complicated.

 

[Ty Webb]

+1
Very bad for the sport. Only a deal will save golf. Let players play whatever they want. The solution isn't complicated.

Egos may get in the way here. To me, it seems like the perfect structure would have been to largely keep the PGA as is, maybe cutting some events from the schedule and then integrating a team concept like LIV at various times during the year.

You use the PGAT as a feeder into LIV matches. The PGAT stays as the "dominant" tour in the sense that's where players accumulate their OGWR points and qualify for other events, majors, and then the LIV thing is an offshoot, almost made for TV thing. Like a team version of the Fed Ex Cup.

But at this point, the PIF has poured too much into it and Norman is so hell bent on sticking it to the Tour, I am not sure that type of set up would work.

One thing I think the LIV guys miss is that I think they overestimate how much Yassir is tied to the whole LIV model/format. I think what he wanted was a foothold in golf and Norman presented him with an interesting option to shake it up. I think if the PGAT gave Yassir what he wanted, he'd turn on the LIV format in a heartbeat.

 

[WhiteBus]

What’s recent? Rahm won 1 last year. Scottie beat 2 of the major winners last year to win the Players. I guess Rahm is as good as Clark and Harman.

Rahm is only as good a Clark and Harmen?? 🤣🤣🤣 Yeah ok 🙄

 

[knightfan7]

Nobody cares about the Players. Majors or bust.

$4.5 million, 5 year Tour exemption including the Players. A 3 year exemptions into the OPENS, Masters, and PGA, 750 FedEx points and a lot of Ryder Cup and President's Cup points.

So you're pretty much set for years on a real professional tour.

Exactly who doesn't care beside DJ, Phil, and Bryson?

 

[T2Kplus20]

$4.5 million, 5 year Tour exemption including the Players. A 3 year exemptions into the OPENS, Masters, and PGA, 750 FedEx points and a lot of Ryder Cup and President's Cup points.

So you're pretty much set for years on a real professional tour.

Exactly who doesn't care beside DJ, Phil, and Bryson?

Peanuts compared to winning a major.

 

[jtung230]

Nobody cares about the Players. Majors or bust.

Don’t you mean recent majors? Or you need to keep moving the goal post?

 

[jtung230]

Rahm is only as good a Clark and Harmen?? 🤣🤣🤣 Yeah ok 🙄

Look who is missing a sense of humor now.

 

[WhiteBus]

Look who is missing a sense of humor now.

Nice try. Your failure is everyone knows you don't have single funny bone in your body and your MO is constantly putting down any golfer that joined the LIV. So your comment wasn't a joke but just your constant disdain for the LIV players. What is funny is that you actually thought you could come up with a joke. Or have any respect for a LIV player.