Rutgers won the lottery
- Thread starter RU72
- Start date
I remember Mason Gross.
Not a huge Bloustein fan. Not for a state U anyway.
His move was bigger time sports, not big time. He never shared that vision of a big 10 school. He could have cut 20 years off the growth curve.
Last edited:
An ex-boss referred to the lottery as a Stupidity Tax.
I am of the mindset pernetti was an awful AD . Mike rice , Kyle flood and wanting to keep Fred hill junior . From the inside info I had , it was mulchahy and schiano that did the heavy lifting . Pernetti gets an assist , but otherwise an awful awful AD.
But it’s hard to argue with RU72 , he’s been on a roll lately . So I think there is some truth to pernetti doing a good job here . But I also think any somewhat competent AD would have got it done . That’s their job
I haven't met anyone more media savvy than Tim. What he did before Rutgers at CBS was tremendous. He had a book for Delany,who always wanted a footprint in NYC since he was an NJ guy. It was about the Big Ten Network which was only doing decently and was 5 years old. It was basic cable in its origin and not long after Rutgers joined became a stand alone PSU station. Bloustein was brilliant and tenacious with his AAU vision. That was mandatory.2006 was very important. Tim sold the network vision to Delany. No other single factor was more important.
If we weren't in the Big 10 now, I doubt we would be invited in. Only big established brands are desired targets now. Be very thankful for Pernetti and Delaney being the right people at the right time and jumping through the window before it closed. Rutgers sports history is littered with bad luck and bad decisions (see Gruninger saying no to the Big East invite in the early 80's). This was a great move that changed the course of RU sports.
Flood wasn’t Tim’s fault. You gotta blame the president there. We were given no budget to work with and GS had lined up an amazing recruiting class which we for sure would’ve lost if Tim went with an external unproven coach not connected to RU. It’s easy to point to coaches who proved themselves in subsequent years and say Tim should’ve gone after them. That’s hindsight. In reality - Flood is doing just fine for himself now. He didn’t work out long term at RU due to some unfortunate off court situations but blaming Tim for that is crazy. Hiring him was nothing like the Ash hire.
No matter the circumstances , those were his moves and he lived and died by them.
Flood, rice and wanting to keep Fred hill jr.
He owns it
All Pernetti did was fill out the paperwork. Mulcahy got fired for doing what needed to be done for us to get into the BIG.
Flood should have been named interim Head coach, not permanent. Would it have cost a recruit or two? Maybe. But at least he should have had to earn the permanent role, not have it handed to him by default as a 1st time head coach.
It’s easy to say that now in hindsight. The truth is though, anyone who thinks the popular opinion after the first 9-4 season would’ve been to kick interim HC Flood out and replace him with an unproven (again - the president wasn’t shelling out the money for a proven guy) is kidding themselves. That’s the point a decision would’ve been made.
That 9-4 team tied for a share of the BE title. You can argue a disappointing finish but based our history that was a pretty good year at the time overall. The Cincy and Syracuse wins were good wins and even though Arkansas wasn’t good - that was a big win. Kent State loss was disappointing but they had a pretty good team that year. I see no way after that season that Flood wouldn’t have been retained and hired full time.
Again, very inaccurate. Mulcahy played a big role as I’ve stated..but Pernetti’s expertise played THE ROLE in getting us in
I've always called it the idiot tax, lol - never played and never will. The fundamental problem with it for me and many others when they think deeply about it is that it's not money earned (which eventually leads to guilt) and that's part of why so many people truly aren't happy after winning - the other element in some cases is that winners often get approached by all kinds of friends and family looking for $$ leading the winners to wonder who still likes them for themselves.
Two great posts. None of this happens without Schiano and Schiano doesn't happen without Mulcahy. Tim closed the deal, so he obviously gets some credit, but the critical groundwork was laid by Greg and Bob.
Let me hit for a few hundred million and I will let you know if you’re right
Went 9-4 his first year & bowling. Interim tag would have been replaced end of season.
- 2001 - Uncle Bob takes a huge chance and hires Greg.
///////
Agree mainly with all of the points with the exception of the above.
First he tried-real hard- to get Darnell of western michigan to say yes. If he did there’s no GS.
Second, how big of a chance is it to hire the defensive coordinator on a then perennial at or near national championship team-its not at all. RU and its fans lusted for Miami in that era. Likely any miami assistant, much less the DC, would have been welcomed with open arms. The fact that they were jersey roots made it even easier. GS as many know had Rutgers on his radar and it was made known that there may be some interest. The age thing is overblown especially considering how very very low our possession records was in at the end of the Terry ‘Shea era.
Many of the points above as indicated are accurate, but this one needs to be put to bed as its a post facto retelling ( one that mulcahy tried to spin) that just aint so.
///////
Agree mainly with all of the points with the exception of the above.
First he tried-real hard- to get Darnell of western michigan to say yes. If he did there’s no GS.
Second, how big of a chance is it to hire the defensive coordinator on a then perennial at or near national championship team-its not at all. RU and its fans lusted for Miami in that era. Likely any miami assistant, much less the DC, would have been welcomed with open arms. The fact that they were jersey roots made it even easier. GS as many know had Rutgers on his radar and it was made known that there may be some interest. The age thing is overblown especially considering how very very low our possession records was in at the end of the Terry ‘Shea era.
Many of the points above as indicated are accurate, but this one needs to be put to bed as its a post facto retelling ( one that mulcahy tried to spin) that just aint so.
Sometimes the lottery is a good bet. You have to look at what the "expected value" of your bet is. When the prize gets very high, you are basically entering the game playing with other people's money. I play when the prize is high.
Exactly. And nobody gets a one year deal so he wouldn’t have be canned after the 6-7 year either and certainly not after going 8-5 the first year in the BIG.
At rutgers flood did enough to come back for 2013 . He should have been fired after 2013 at the very least.
But the warning signs were already there in 2012 . A great fan already coined the term “flood is a dud “ Kent state. At Pitt and sending Greene back in the game when it looked like the kid had a concussion (not more is made of this). The va tech debacle.
But you’re right , rutgers was not gonna fire him then. Plus, to do what ? Hire a guy like ash ?
We didn’t get to where we are overnight . It’s been a series of bad decisions and all-time blunders that many fans could see coming a mile away.
It is amazing how far a program can fall after back-back coaching misses. It's 4 years per year and probably another 3-4 for the next coach to right the ship(with recruits). Even with portal, it's almost impossible to change everything in 1-2 years.
Each hire, even though 4-5 year contract can set the program back ,7-8 years. Glad we got the last one right again :)
Each hire, even though 4-5 year contract can set the program back ,7-8 years. Glad we got the last one right again :)
The “Flood is a dud” Kent State line is laughable. He wasn’t getting canned because of one loss to a good MAC team that went undefeated in their conference until the championship game where they lost in OT to another undefeated team that went on to play in a BCS bowl. Every other RU coach we’ve had has had far worse losses in their tenures.
He didn’t have a “good” season the following year, but we still made a bowl game. He doesn’t get enough credit for that Arkansas win either based on how they did in SEC play. Arkansas’s 2013 schedule in the SEC was unprecedented in terms of difficulty. All ranked SEC teams except one (and they lost that one game to Miss State in OT who ended up with 7 wins). That team would’ve been competitive in the BIG west most years. The ND bowl showing was respectable (we lost by 2 possessions). Flood wasn’t getting fired after 2013 either (not after taking us to 2 bowl games). And then certainly not 2014 - he deserves credit for a very good season that year.
I guess what I’m saying here is when you take a step back and consider that our president refused to put resources towards bringing in an accomplished coach - there isn’t a point on the timeline where it would’ve made rational sense to replace a guy that led us to 3 straight bowl games, with someone else who had never been a head coach.
Last edited:
Flood was a mixed bag. Strong football skills, well liked with good relationships, he failed to be commanding in his leadership and that showed off the field, in practice, and in recruiting.
Yes. Most deals get done by talking, negotiating, etc.
Tim knew what it took to get us in…
No doubt. And it takes time for the areas where he struggled to impact game outcomes. The point I’m making is that given our administration wasn’t willing to spring for an accomplished coach, it’s hindsight 20 / 20 to say Tim should’ve rolled the dice with an unproven instead of promoting Flood. And then he took us to 3 straight bowl games, so again, if you don’t have the funds to bring in a proven guy, it seems like a major reach to say Tim should’ve fired him at any point in the first 3 years.
I actually liked Flood early on, and when we started the 2012 season ranked #18 at 7-0, I was excited as hell at our prospects for a tremendous season. Then Kent State happened, which was as deflating and demoralizing a loss as any I can recall.
And it wasn’t so much that we lost (to a very good MAC team), but Flood allowing Nova to stay on the field after his third INT was unforgivable. I was at the game (Homecoming?) and I was livid. Nova went on to throw 6 interceptions that game, which was otherwise winnable throughout.
That’s when I started questioning Flood’s judgment.
And it wasn’t so much that we lost (to a very good MAC team), but Flood allowing Nova to stay on the field after his third INT was unforgivable. I was at the game (Homecoming?) and I was livid. Nova went on to throw 6 interceptions that game, which was otherwise winnable throughout.
That’s when I started questioning Flood’s judgment.
Last edited:
I don’t have time to give a full reply to this, but suffice it to say that I strongly disagree with your take here. Bob hiring Greg — as the youngest D1-A head football coach in the country, who had zero head coaching experience — to build up an awful program from scratch, was absolutely a huge gamble.
Selling Pernetti short shows how uninformed some are. In those days he, and even his wife were on the phone constantly schmoozing the BIG. His relationships were unbelievably important to getting us into the BIG. Denying that just shows your anti Pernetti bias and is unfair.
I think this is a good thread but I think we are looking at things on an island.....let's rephrase the question this way??
If there was a "re-draft" and you as fans, understand economics, location, school size and approximate cost or time to acquire talent for both academics and athletes, would RU be closer to the Top of the "draft", or the middle or towards the end of the 1st round to early 2nd round.
If this was a NBA Draft number of 60 draft spots and we have 60 or so "Power programs", RU would be a 1st round draft pick (Top 30).
If I add this layer to the equation.....Yes, Northwestern is and has been in the B1G, because of location and academics, then athletics. Northwestern in a redraft, would be behind RU, if we are looking at NYC vs Chicago demographics and school background.
I think schools outside of the B1G and Pac 12 and in locations in the South and Far West would be strong considerations over some of the current B1G programs, but it is a matter of when you get into a league, more often than not, over whatever achievements have been made.
RU has a bright future and it's going to have some bumps on the way up, but it's definitely trending in the right directions, on a number of levels.
If there was a "re-draft" and you as fans, understand economics, location, school size and approximate cost or time to acquire talent for both academics and athletes, would RU be closer to the Top of the "draft", or the middle or towards the end of the 1st round to early 2nd round.
If this was a NBA Draft number of 60 draft spots and we have 60 or so "Power programs", RU would be a 1st round draft pick (Top 30).
If I add this layer to the equation.....Yes, Northwestern is and has been in the B1G, because of location and academics, then athletics. Northwestern in a redraft, would be behind RU, if we are looking at NYC vs Chicago demographics and school background.
I think schools outside of the B1G and Pac 12 and in locations in the South and Far West would be strong considerations over some of the current B1G programs, but it is a matter of when you get into a league, more often than not, over whatever achievements have been made.
RU has a bright future and it's going to have some bumps on the way up, but it's definitely trending in the right directions, on a number of levels.
The 2013 season was a disaster. Absolutely destroyed at home by Houston and Cincinnati and smacked around on the road vs. UCF. Squeaked past a terrible Temple team. Please don’t defend it.
Sorry Shill. That was one of my favorite seasons ever. The drubbings vs. Cincy, Houston and UCF set us up for the dramatic bowl-clinching victory at the end of the season during a 20-degree night vs. a shivering USF team. Flood stared all of his critics down on that historic night and made a statement. Adversity builds character.
There were a lot of distractions that season. It was a weird transition year playing in a conference we were in for only one year. We still went to a bowl game and the Pin Stripe wasn’t a complete embarrassment.
He wasn’t getting fired at that point. We had no money to hire a replacement let alone pay for buy out. As has been explained, had he been hired as interim the predicament would’ve been even worse as his contract would be brand new (finalized after the 9-4 season). Flood was getting a crack at a season in the BIG to see how he’d do. There was no getting around that really. and he had a good year 8-5. So he wasn’t getting the boot in 2014 either.
