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Shutdown and RU budget?

MoobyCow

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Nov 28, 2001
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I haven't seen anything RU specific, but there was an article on what is happening at SHU (not pretty) and this one lists a bunch of colleges across the country who are facing issues.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/covid-19-colleges-university-furlough

Add in local and state budget holes due to the virus and what that means as far as help from the states and it's looking like there will be huge issues for higher ed in the coming year.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/covid-19-colleges-university-furlough

Found an RU specific article:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/c...venue-due-to-pandemic-barchi-says/ar-BB12lbrH
 
Schools like SHU are gonna take a hit for sure...expensive private schools that aren't among the elites like the Ivies or ND, Northwestern, Hopkins, etc. Small, lesser known private schools like Rider are in big trouble.
 
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FWIW, on my son's admitted students tour in Feb(?), the one thing that sold us on RU for Civil Engineering as opposed to a really swanky private school in Hoboken is the amount of funding that NJ is throwing at Rutgers for research. The professor rattled off the work they are doing for the state and showed us the cool toys they have developed to monitor traffic and road/bridge stability. Look at the Covid test the school developed as well. There's no reason for the State or Federal government to give that money to a small private school, which is why State Us have a significant advantage going forward.
 
RU is cutting budgets and freezing hiring. In addition, the campuses are all being asked to cut their budgets. The state budget is months away from being passed, but probably that will cut appropriations to RU because of the extensive shortfall in tax revenues caused by the virus.
 
This will also significantly affect public universities.

Consider Penn State University with their 20 branch campuses.
Pennsylvania is expecting maybe a $2 to $4 Billion Dollar Budget Shortfall, so how much funding will the state be able to give to the State University System in addition to the State Related Universities. The more branch campuses you have the bigger the problem. Couple that with a falling stock market and the negative effect it will have on State Pension Programs. These two issues alone will only exacerbate state budgets going forward.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
This will also significantly affect public universities.

Consider Penn State University with their 20 branch campuses.
Pennsylvania is expecting maybe a $2 to $4 Billion Dollar Budget Shortfall, so how much funding will the state be able to give to the State University System in addition to the State Related Universities. The more branch campuses you have the bigger the problem. Couple that with a falling stock market and the negative effect it will have on State Pension Programs. These two issues alone will only exacerbate state budgets going forward.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Panther, I suppose I could look this up, but are the only two four year campuses of Pitt in Pittsburgh and Johnstown ? Are there any two year feeder schools ?
 
My son who is a law student at RU Newark was told by an adjunct professor today that Rutgers will eliminate all of their hundreds of adjunct professor positions university-wide immediately at the end of the school year, as they are expecting a 25% budget cut. Very hard times ahead.
 
I haven't seen anything RU specific, but there was an article on what is happening at SHU (not pretty) and this one lists a bunch of colleges across the country who are facing issues.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/covid-19-colleges-university-furlough

Add in local and state budget holes due to the virus and what that means as far as help from the states and it's looking like there will be huge issues for higher ed in the coming year.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/covid-19-colleges-university-furlough

Found an RU specific article:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/c...venue-due-to-pandemic-barchi-says/ar-BB12lbrH

Where is the SHU article?
 
My son who is a law student at RU Newark was told by an adjunct professor today that Rutgers will eliminate all of their hundreds of adjunct professor positions university-wide immediately at the end of the school year, as they are expecting a 25% budget cut. Very hard times ahead.

I have talked to the head person at the law school in Camden. She says that there will be a cutback in use of adjuncts, but that Rutgers will not eliminate all adjuncts (also known as PTLs). But you're right that hard times are ahead. And the fact that the stock market is down will discourage older faculty from retiring and getting off the university's payroll.
 
Panther, I suppose I could look this up, but are the only two four year campuses of Pitt in Pittsburgh and Johnstown ? Are there any two year feeder schools ?

I'm sure Panther guy can give a complete picture but of the 4 other regional campuses that Pitt has besides the main campus, I believe only one of them is strictly a 2-year/Associate degree granting campus. That said, I would imagine any of the other three campuses have program structures that likely allow for the first 2 years of study on that campus and then transfer to either the main campus or one of the others (except for the 2-year only one, obviously) to complete the balance of a 4-year/Bachelor degree.
 
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Panther, I suppose I could look this up, but are the only two four year campuses of Pitt in Pittsburgh and Johnstown ? Are there any two year feeder schools ?


Pitt has 4 Branch Campuses:

Titusville-2 year- 255 students
Bradford-4 year-1229 students
Greensburg-4 year-1436 students
Johnstown-4 year-2713 students.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Titusville-2 year- 255 students

Surprised to see such a low enrollment, to the point of asking why does Pitt even bother with keeping essentially a community college under its umbrella? Folks might question if the benefits outweigh not only operational/capital costs but also potential dilution of the Pitt "brand" or a Pitt degree.

What does the UP-T physical plant look like versus what it only should be to support such a small student body?

Is there a % breakdown of UP-T grads by:
1) transfer to Pitt-Oakland (or any of the other 3 branches)
2) transfer/matriculate to 4-yr school outside the Pitt umbrella
3) just get the AA/AS degree and enter workforce/pursue next endeavor
 
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FWIW, on my son's admitted students tour in Feb(?), the one thing that sold us on RU for Civil Engineering as opposed to a really swanky private school in Hoboken is the amount of funding that NJ is throwing at Rutgers for research. The professor rattled off the work they are doing for the state and showed us the cool toys they have developed to monitor traffic and road/bridge stability. Look at the Covid test the school developed as well. There's no reason for the State or Federal government to give that money to a small private school, which is why State Us have a significant advantage going forward.

Rutgers does more research than the rest of the schools in NJ combined.
 
The linked item is from the Wall Street Journal and so is behind a pay wall. It says that Montclair State has been told not to expect the last $12 million of state aid for the current fiscal year, and that New Jersey's budget office has put back in reserves $138 million that is supposed to go to community colleges and public universities. Other states are doing the same kind of things.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/public...ly-11587653753?mod=djemCapitalJournalDaybreak
 
Surprised to see such a low enrollment, to the point of asking why does Pitt even bother with keeping essentially a community college under its umbrella? Folks might question if the benefits outweigh not only operational/capital costs but also potential dilution of the Pitt "brand" or a Pitt degree.

What does the UP-T physical plant look like versus what it only should be to support such a small student body?

Is there a % breakdown of UP-T grads by:
1) transfer to Pitt-Oakland (or any of the other 3 branches)
2) transfer/matriculate to 4-yr school outside the Pitt umbrella
3) just get the AA/AS degree and enter workforce/pursue next endeavor


To give you some perspective on the Titusville Campus.
Pitt actually explored shutting down the Titusville Campus. Basically give the facilities to the local community and thus reduce Pitt to only 3 Branch Campuses.

When Pitt offered this scenario, they got push back from the Republican State Rep. who said such a move would hurt the community from a jobs, education and financial perspective. As a compromise (good will) Pitt retained some minimal presence and basically allowed the community to have the facility and bring in other educational opportunities (community college type/not associated with Pitt, trade/service skills others I believe).

Now when you politically look at Pennsylvania, It had been dominated by a Republican Governor and Republican controlled state legislature. During this time the Republican's have been cutting education funding for the State Related Universities (as well as state university system), I think Pitt now gets about $150 million per year which is maybe only about 7% of its budget. That is part of the reason Pitt, Penn State and Temple have some of the highest in state tuition costs across the country. Tom Wolf (Pa. new Democratic Governor has been trying to get more funding for the State Related Universities but has been somewhat stymied by the Republican Legislature.

In years past, Pennsylvania had funded the State Related Universities budgets by almost 30% resulting in significantly lower in state tuition for Pennsylvania college students (The good old days).

Based upon the most recent financial distress brought on by Covid-19 Pitt (looking to reduce costs) may have to reevaluate the Titusville Campus decision in the future I suspect.

That is why I brought up Penn State with their 20 or more Branch Campuses (many in Republican controlled rural areas of the state). Penn State has a total student body of about 96,000 student (University Park: 40,000 undergrad/6000 grad students Branch Campuses: 50,000 students). With the Covid 19 problem negatively affecting the finances of many colleges/universities across the country, I am not sure how they will be able keep all of those branch campuses open without significant funding increases by the state at a time when Pennsylvania's budget is now so out of balance ($2 to $ 4 billion).
Again many of the 20 plus Penn State Branch Campuses are in rural Republican Controlled areas (Oh well lets see what happens). Additionally, Pennsylvania State System Universities (14 schools with some near PSU branch campuses) are also facing significant budget problems due to Covid 19 in addition to student body reductions over the years.

Pitt fortunately has no problem attracting students and maintaining a consistent student body (undergrad/grad school total student body of about 35,000 students).

Will have to wait to see how this all shakes out in July (Budget Time in Pennsylvania).

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
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The linked item is from the Wall Street Journal and so is behind a pay wall. It says that Montclair State has been told not to expect the last $12 million of state aid for the current fiscal year, and that New Jersey's budget office has put back in reserves $138 million that is supposed to go to community colleges and public universities. Other states are doing the same kind of things.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/public...ly-11587653753?mod=djemCapitalJournalDaybreak

I don't think many people have come to grips with what this going to do to school budgets, state budgets, city budgets... It's cataclysmic.
 
I understand from someone involved with the AAUP/AFT faculty union that the administration is saying it needs $200 MM in cuts; so it wants to declare a fiscal emergency and abrogate the union contracts. The next step would be furloughs and then layoffs. Perhaps Rutgers anticipates a huge cutback in state aid, and that enrollments will be lower this Fall because of the pandemic.
 
I understand from someone involved with the AAUP/AFT faculty union that the administration is saying it needs $200 MM in cuts; so it wants to declare a fiscal emergency and abrogate the union contracts. The next step would be furloughs and then layoffs. Perhaps Rutgers anticipates a huge cutback in state aid, and that enrollments will be lower this Fall because of the pandemic.
I don't really have anything to add, but I didn't want to like that post. Not unexpected, but ugh.
 
I don't really have anything to add, but I didn't want to like that post. Not unexpected, but ugh.
Time for RU to bust some unions! But seriously, shutting down society has consequences. The government has a lot of people, organizations, and entities to support and try to make whole again. Priorities have to be made and I believe universities may be lower on the list.....just an opinion.
 
What I suspect will happen is that the Congress will pass another relief bill which will give urgently needed cash to the states so they can maintain their state budgets, credit rankings and avoid bankruptcy. Without such a bill, the consequences would be cataclysmic for the states as well as the United States as a whole. Come on Mitch you know you are going to do it and I'll tell you why.

If some states (California,New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania etc.) had to declare bankruptcy the states Municipal Bond markets would collapse. The US Stock Market would be in free fall because the credit worthiness of US Debt. at about $30 Trillion would then come into question. As an example, California if it were a country would have the 5th largest economy in the World.

That is why the Covid 19 impact on education funding (OP) will be bad but somewhat muted by the Federal Aid which will come to states.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Time for RU to bust some unions! But seriously, shutting down society has consequences. The government has a lot of people, organizations, and entities to support and try to make whole again. Priorities have to be made and I believe universities may be lower on the list.....just an opinion.


One of the remedies might be to nationalize pharma so they don't have to give a match of 13% for someone's 401K:)
 
One of the remedies might be to nationalize pharma so they don't have to give a match of 13% for someone's 401K:)

I don't understand. The University surely didn't contribute 13% of my salary to TIAA-CREF (it's technically a 403 plan, not a 401(k). I think the University kicked in 7-8%. Nor do I understand what nationalization would mean and how it would affect the contribution.
 
BTW, I understand that the state is not going to pay $70 million of appropriations to Rutgers that were promised in the current budget. Rutgers is also anticipating a decline in enrollment. That's why it's looking for $200 MM in cuts. I have no idea how Rutgers plans to achieve them. Some faculty in NB have exceptionally light teaching loads, but increasing those loads would make it more difficult to do research. I am *very* glad I'm now retired.
 
I don't understand. The University surely didn't contribute 13% of my salary to TIAA-CREF (it's technically a 403 plan, not a 401(k). I think the University kicked in 7-8%. Nor do I understand what nationalization would mean and how it would affect the contribution.
Tom was referring to another thread that we were chatting in, about 401k and retirement systems. At my company (pharma industry), I contribute 6% to my 401k and they contribute 13.25%.

Just joking around with each other.
 
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BTW, I understand that the state is not going to pay $70 million of appropriations to Rutgers that were promised in the current budget. Rutgers is also anticipating a decline in enrollment. That's why it's looking for $200 MM in cuts. I have no idea how Rutgers plans to achieve them. Some faculty in NB have exceptionally light teaching loads, but increasing those loads would make it more difficult to do research. I am *very* glad I'm now retired.
Congrats on your well-timed retirement!
 
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Tom was referring to another thread that we were chatting in, about 401k and retirement systems. At my company (pharma industry), I contribute 6% to my 401k and they contribute 13.25%.

Just joking around with each other.


Yes I am very envious.
 
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I understand from someone involved with the AAUP/AFT faculty union that the administration is saying it needs $200 MM in cuts; so it wants to declare a fiscal emergency and abrogate the union contracts. The next step would be furloughs and then layoffs. Perhaps Rutgers anticipates a huge cutback in state aid, and that enrollments will be lower this Fall because of the pandemic.

No doubt about substantial cutbacks. The State will be missing out on a full quarter of sales and income tax revenues, so dramatic cuts will be made everywhere. And, Rutgers has never been a priority for funding even in better times.
 
FWIW, on my son's admitted students tour in Feb(?), the one thing that sold us on RU for Civil Engineering as opposed to a really swanky private school in Hoboken is the amount of funding that NJ is throwing at Rutgers for research. The professor rattled off the work they are doing for the state and showed us the cool toys they have developed to monitor traffic and road/bridge stability. Look at the Covid test the school developed as well. There's no reason for the State or Federal government to give that money to a small private school, which is why State Us have a significant advantage going forward.
IIRC, weren't you fairly down on RU as a choice for your son? Has that changed? Stevens touts itself as having one of the best paybacks on tuition or something like that, and I may be wrong, but I don't think Civil is one of their strongest areas. RU has a great network in NJ and elsewhere for Civil Engineering.

Back in the mid 1980's, I was admitted to Stevens and Rutgers and Lehigh. Lehigh offered me no aid, and Stevens made a compelling case, offering about $5 or 6K in aid, bringing the cost within about $2500/year at Rutgers. But this amount was a small fortune to my family, and Rutgers was my only choice. It worked out well. I majored in Ceramic Engineering, and during that time, Rutgers was swimming in State and Federal research money. The Center For Ceramic Engineering was built, and shortly after, the Center for Fiber Optics Materials Research. Rutgers crushes the other local schools in research $$.

If your son winds up at RU, and gets involved with the right professors and research projects, he will have an outstanding experience.
 
Another significant impact on Universities budgets that I haven't seen mentioned here is .... future enrollment of international and out-of-state students. These students often pay 2-3x more than the in-state students for the same services. Therefore that is a significant profit margin Universities are going to be giving up immediately in Fall 2020 and the impacts are likely to continue to trickle into incoming classes 2021 and possibly even 2022.
 
Another significant impact on Universities budgets that I haven't seen mentioned here is .... future enrollment of international and out-of-state students. These students often pay 2-3x more than the in-state students for the same services. Therefore that is a significant profit margin Universities are going to be giving up immediately in Fall 2020 and the impacts are likely to continue to trickle into incoming classes 2021 and possibly even 2022.
Hopefully out of state and international students will be replaced by high quality local students who now want to stay home. That would help, but obviously not a full financial replacement.
 
Hopefully out of state and international students will be replaced by high quality local students who now want to stay home. That would help, but obviously not a full financial replacement.

Replacing them with students won't be a problem. Its the financial delta of replacing an out-of-state paying student vs an in-state paying student. That delta which is pure cash profit margin for the school is more than $16,000 per.

71,000 students enrolled at RU for 2019 across all campuses, grad & undergrad.

18.8% of those were out-of-state in 2019 = ~13,348 out-of-state students at RU

If you just assume 40% of those out-of-state students (about 5k) are changing their choice to stay local .....

5k students changing from out-state to in-state, so thats $16k per each of those...

THATS $89.6m cash profit the University loses out on! HUGE

Add that to the money the state is going to cut back from the school ...

And you have some real serious financial issues that ALL schools will likely be facing !
 
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What I suspect will happen is that the Congress will pass another relief bill which will give urgently needed cash to the states so they can maintain their state budgets, credit rankings and avoid bankruptcy. Without such a bill, the consequences would be cataclysmic for the states as well as the United States as a whole. Come on Mitch you know you are going to do it and I'll tell you why.

I'm not convinced they don't want the states to collapse. It's perfect excuse to privatize the hell out of everything and sell state assets at pennies on the dollar.

Sure, it's a disaster for 99.9% of the people, but if you're rich and know it's coming think of all the stuff you can get on the cheap.
 
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