OT: Philadelphia resurrects Big Five (now six)

[Doctor Worm]

The Athletic is reporting that starting in 2024, the traditional Philly Big Five (Villanova, St. Joes, LaSalle, Temple, and Penn - plus Drexel to make it six), will play a annual December tournament. The format will be two pods of three, each playing a two game round robin. Then a cross-pod tripleheader to determine the champion, third place, and fifth place. So each team plays three games.

I love this. Absolutely love it. Would that NY/NJ would follow suit. Rutgers, Princeton, Seton Hall, St. john's, Fordham, Manhattan.

 

[MADHAT1]

agree this is a great move for Philly College fans and something NJ needs to do.
But a Jersey only Tourney.
Rutgers, Princeton , Seton Hall and the previous year's highest ranked program of the NJ college MBB teams left .

First time tourney is played: site will be by luck of draw, every time after that will be at the home of previous year's Tourney winner.

 

[bigmatt718]

The only part of the Philly Tourney that is a fail is that it's at Wells Fargo Center and not the Palestra.

 

[dconifer]

Would love to see a Washington D.C. version: Georgetown, George Washington, American, Maryland, George Mason, Navy, perhaps.

 

[Joey Bags]

we should never play another NJ team again according to some

 

[AdventureHasAName]

NYC Championship ... Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Johns, Hofstra, Manhattan, Syracuse, St. Bonaventure, and Iona played in MSG on December 23, 24, and 25th. This should be an annual event with a trophy that looks like the Statue of Liberty.

 

[Skull83]

How about a 4 team NJ bracket with RU, Seton Hall, Princeton and St. Peter's (my arbitrary selection of the teams I think have the most tradition) and a four team NYC metro bracket with St. John's, Fordham, Manhattan and Iona. The winners of the two brackets meet at the Garden for the title, with the runners up of the two brackets meeting in a third place game at the Garden as part of a doubleheader. You could work it out so everyone gets a minimum of two or three games and 4 teams would end up at the Garden for the doubleheader.

 

[Lawboy12007]

How about a 4 team NJ bracket with RU, Seton Hall, Princeton and St. Peter's (my arbitrary selection of the teams I think have the most tradition) and a four team NYC metro bracket with St. John's, Fordham, Manhattan and Iona. The winners of the two brackets meet at the Garden for the title, with the runners up of the two brackets meeting in a third place game at the Garden as part of a doubleheader. You could work it out so everyone gets a minimum of two or three games and 4 teams would end up at the Garden for the doubleheader.

Unbalanced with SJU usually having an easy time getting to finals while 3 Jersey teams fight it out to get there. No one in Hersey besides Peters agrees to this and maybe it should be Rider or Monmouth depending the year.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

NYC Championship ... Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Johns, Hofstra, Manhattan, Syracuse, St. Bonaventure, and Iona played in MSG on December 23, 24, and 25th. This should be an annual event with a trophy that looks like the Statue of Liberty.

Syracuse?

 

[Skull83]

Unbalanced with SJU usually having an easy time getting to finals while 3 Jersey teams fight it out to get there. No one in Hersey besides Peters agrees to this and maybe it should be Rider or Monmouth depending the year.

Just speculating for fun lawboy, right off the bat I don't think RU would agree to it simply because Princeton would be involved. In the spirit of the Big Five, I was going with my biased view of New Jersey's traditional Big Four programs. Since the Philly boys are letting Drexel into their club, I suppose we could include Rider, Monmouth, FDU and/or NJIT 🙂

 

[Knight Owl]

The Athletic is reporting that starting in 2024, the traditional Philly Big Five (Villanova, St. Joes, LaSalle, Temple, and Penn - plus Drexel to make it six), will play a annual December tournament. The format will be two pods of three, each playing a two game round robin. Then a cross-pod tripleheader to determine the champion, third place, and fifth place. So each team plays three games.

I love this. Absolutely love it. Would that NY/NJ would follow suit. Rutgers, Princeton, Seton Hall, St. john's, Fordham, Manhattan.

So I wonder if there is a kicker like Villanova gets to pick their pod each season. Villanova was the one who ended the Big 5.

 

[Scarlet Blind]

It would have to be a NJ/NY tournament from 8 separate conferences, pretty sure exempt tournament avoids conflicts in conference schedules for a third meeting in a year if those teams play 2 conference games every year like 2 Big East teams.

Villanova(BE), St Joe's(A10), La Salle(A10), Temple(AAC), Penn(Ivy), Drexel(CAA)

The only trouble you might run into if St Joe's and La Salle play 2x in a 15 team A10, and a 3rd time for this which could be easily avoidable in this format in different pods unless both LaSalle and St Joe's finish 2-0 in seperate pods, it's easily avoidable if each team finish 1-1 or 0-2 but love the revival of this tradition.

 

[Doctor Worm]

So I wonder if there is a kicker like Villanova gets to pick their pod each season. Villanova was the one who ended the Big 5.

Pod 1 is Temple, LaSalle, and Drexel. Pod 2 is Villanova, Penn, and St. Joseph's. This is supposedly permanent.

I guess they wanted to separate Villanova and Temple?

 

[Doctor Worm]

It would have to be a NJ/NY tournament from 8 separate conferences, pretty sure exempt tournament can't disrupt conference schedule if those teams play 2 conference games every year like 2 Big East teams.

Villanova(BE), St Joe'(A10), La Salle(A10)
Temple(AAC), Penn(Ivy), Drexel(CAA)

The only trouble you might run into if St Joe's and La Salle play 2x in a 15 team A10, and a 3rd time for this which could be easily avoidable in this format in different pod unless both LaSalle and St Joe's finish 2-0 in a pod but love the revival of this tradition.

LaSalle and St Joe's are in separate pods.

 

[S_Janowski]

agree this is a great move for Philly College fans and something NJ needs to do.
But a Jersey only Tourney.
Rutgers, Princeton , Seton Hall and the previous year's highest ranked program of the NJ college MBB teams left .

First time tourney is played: site will be by luck of draw, every time after that will be at the home of previous year's Tourney winner.

Agree that if this is were something to happen a NJ only tournament would make the most sense.

We could keep our rivalry with SHU somewhat intact also.

I don’t see any reason to extend such a tournament to NYC schools.

 

[Knight Owl]

Pod 1 is Temple, LaSalle, and Drexel. Pod 2 is Villanova, Penn, and St. Joseph's. This is supposedly permanent.

I guess they wanted to separate Villanova and Temple?

Since Martelli left, St Joes has been forgotten about in terms of hoops.
Temple used to win the Big 5 quite often but Chaney never won a NCAA regional let alone a Natty because he didn’t like coaching offense and just relied on talented guards making plays with a traditional post up center in the middle.

 

[ecojew]

I seriously doubt that any of this would generate much excitement. The Big 5 had tradition going for it and was very competitive for decades. Then, Villanova joined the Big East and dominated TV, leaving St. Joe's, LaSalle, and Penn in the dust. The only thing that saved Temple from sharing that fate was its coach and their spectacular run to #1 in the 87-88 (?) season, after which they were "permitted" back on TV as well.

In an effort to replicate the Big 5, the "NY/NJ 7" was created in the late 70s. Hopefully someone can check the year on that. It was a big flop - no one really paid much attention to it. Manhattan, Fordham, St. Peter's, and Columbia had already begun their long decline into irrelevance and the group had no TV coverage.

If it happens as a holiday season tournament, fine, but don't think about it becoming something that will not happen.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

I seriously doubt that any of this would generate much excitement. The Big 5 had tradition going for it and was very competitive for decades. Then, Villanova joined the Big East and dominated TV, leaving St. Joe's, LaSalle, and Penn in the dust. The only thing that saved Temple from sharing that fate was its coach and their spectacular run to #1 in the 87-88 (?) season, after which they were "permitted" back on TV as well.

In an effort to replicate the Big 5, the "NY/NJ 7" was created in the late 70s. Hopefully someone can check the year on that. It was a big flop - no one really paid much attention to it. Manhattan, Fordham, St. Peter's, and Columbia had already begun their long decline into irrelevance and the group had no TV coverage.

If it happens as a holiday season tournament, fine, but don't think about it becoming something that will not happen.

We used to host the Jersey Classic...

 

[rucoe89]

Could just do a 1-8 seeding using pre-season rankings of Rutgers, Seton Hall, Rider, Monmouth, St. Peters, FDU, NJIT, Princeton. Winners of first round proceed to Champion Bracket for 1-4 finish and losers of first round to Consolation Bracket for 5-8 finish.

 

[AdventureHasAName]

Agree that if this is were something to happen a NJ only tournament would make the most sense.

We could keep our rivalry with SHU somewhat intact also.

I don’t see any reason to extend such a tournament to NYC schools.

If the goal is to brand Rutgers as "NYC's team," it needs to be a NYC tournament. MSG is a draw (both in recruiting and television eyeballs). Nationally speaking, nobody cares who is the best college team in NJ. Best college team in NYC, on the otherhand? People will watch that on ESPN in the afternoon on Christmas Eve.

 

[RU at the shore]

Since Martelli left, St Joes has been forgotten about in terms of hoops.
Temple used to win the Big 5 quite often but Chaney never won a NCAA regional let alone a Natty because he didn’t like coaching offense and just relied on talented guards making plays with a traditional post up center in the middle.

My kind of coach, lol

 

[Jerseylegends]

The Athletic is reporting that starting in 2024, the traditional Philly Big Five (Villanova, St. Joes, LaSalle, Temple, and Penn - plus Drexel to make it six), will play a annual December tournament. The format will be two pods of three, each playing a two game round robin. Then a cross-pod tripleheader to determine the champion, third place, and fifth place. So each team plays three games.

I love this. Absolutely love it. Would that NY/NJ would follow suit. Rutgers, Princeton, Seton Hall, St. john's, Fordham, Manhattan.

NJIT has a surprisingly decent program...Friend of mine played for them a couple of years back. Didn't even know they were d1 until they recruited him. But good program..

 

[RU848789]

The Athletic is reporting that starting in 2024, the traditional Philly Big Five (Villanova, St. Joes, LaSalle, Temple, and Penn - plus Drexel to make it six), will play a annual December tournament. The format will be two pods of three, each playing a two game round robin. Then a cross-pod tripleheader to determine the champion, third place, and fifth place. So each team plays three games.

I love this. Absolutely love it. Would that NY/NJ would follow suit. Rutgers, Princeton, Seton Hall, St. john's, Fordham, Manhattan.

Growing up in SNJ, I grew up on Big Five hoops, so this sounds like a great idea to me and would love to see something like this in NJ (maybe including NYC)...

 

[rucoe89]

Could just do a 1-8 seeding using pre-season rankings of Rutgers, Seton Hall, Rider, Monmouth, St. Peters, FDU, NJIT, Princeton. Winners of first round proceed to Champion Bracket for 1-4 finish and losers of first round to Consolation Bracket for 5-8 finish.

Thinking about this more, I think it should be the Pork Roll Bracket and the Taylor Ham Bracket. Dunno .....

 

[RU848789]

Could just do a 1-8 seeding using pre-season rankings of Rutgers, Seton Hall, Rider, Monmouth, St. Peters, FDU, NJIT, Princeton. Winners of first round proceed to Champion Bracket for 1-4 finish and losers of first round to Consolation Bracket for 5-8 finish.

I like it and it doesn't really add any games, per se, since we usually play at least a couple of low/mid-major types every year (with 1 from NJ, so why not 2; only Princeton doesn't fit that low/mid-major description in most years) and SHU every year anyway and probably 50-75% of the time it will end with RU-SHU in the final, as we'd be on opposite sides of any bracket (and I assume each of us would only do this if we got the 2 lowest rated teams in the 1st round).

 

[FIJI'83]

So I guess if La Salle and St joe's both somehow made the final they would play each other as a non conference game even though they are both A-10

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

The Athletic is reporting that starting in 2024, the traditional Philly Big Five (Villanova, St. Joes, LaSalle, Temple, and Penn - plus Drexel to make it six), will play a annual December tournament. The format will be two pods of three, each playing a two game round robin. Then a cross-pod tripleheader to determine the champion, third place, and fifth place. So each team plays three games.

I love this. Absolutely love it. Would that NY/NJ would follow suit. Rutgers, Princeton, Seton Hall, St. john's, Fordham, Manhattan.

I freaking LOVE this!

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Psst. NJ has 8 D 1 teams. Would make for a sweet tournament in Newark. Each team plays three games. Rider and St Peter's in separate brackets.

 

[njxchange]

This is 2023, not 1980s. Why restrict yourself to local area? Everyone has access to everywhere around the country.
We dont need to play anyone from Jersey tbh. Let's think big

 

[derleider]

agree this is a great move for Philly College fans and something NJ needs to do.
But a Jersey only Tourney.
Rutgers, Princeton , Seton Hall and the previous year's highest ranked program of the NJ college MBB teams left .

First time tourney is played: site will be by luck of draw, every time after that will be at the home of previous year's Tourney winner.

They should have all 8 teams in NJ do a tourney once every three or four years.