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OT: California moves closer to becoming first state to ban tackle football for kids under 12

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Stats prove it how ? How many autopsies were done on these 9 year olds ? I’ll tell you: none.

The medical opinions of your football cronies are as worthless as their vaccine opinions, and yours no doubt as well.
 
I don’t need to ask. I helped run a town program for the last 9 years. We grew that program to almost 300 kids fielding multiple teams at every single age. My kid is in HS now but our 8th grade year we had enough 8th graders to field 3 teams. We offer free camps twice a week in the summer and routinely get 70 plus kids under the age of 10 to come out. I am also friends with some of the best HS coach’s in NJ. I don’t know one person who is concerned about the safety of a 9 year old playing football. In those years we played in multiple leagues ranging from weighted, to non weighted, to games against the top pop Warner programs in NJ. In countless league meetings injuries concerns were always at the forefront but the safety of the little ones was never a concern. And The stats prove it. Maybe your 2 friends are the outliers.
Maybe they are outliers . But I am going to take their thoughts seriously considering their experiences.
 
Stats prove it how ? How many autopsies were done on these 9 year olds ? I’ll tell you: none.

The medical opinions of your football cronies are as worthless as their vaccine opinions, and yours no doubt as well.
So your two buddies opinions count and nobody else’s do. Makes total sense. Go find the stats for youth football concussions and get back to me. That’s right, you don’t actually care about the data. You care about “feels”. you and all the other blue haired idiots can keep your kids from playing sports while allowing them to use puberty blockers. Leave the rest of us alone.
 
So your two buddies opinions count and nobody else’s do. Makes total sense. Go find the stats for youth football concussions and get back to me. That’s right, you don’t actually care about the data. You care about “feels”. you and all the other blue haired idiots can keep your kids from playing sports while allowing them to use puberty blockers. Leave the rest of us alone.
Whoa . The discussion is about prohibiting tackle football for kids under 12 in California ! You are off the rails ! And trying to derail this thread
 
Yes then ban those too. Civilization will survive. People will find other things to do.

Besides, absence of some sensible laws is not a reason to oppose other sensible laws.
Except there is nothing sensible about the law because it’s based on feelings and not data. If it’s so dangerous why are they doing it gradually? Shouldn’t it be a hard stop? Did we gradually impose the seat belt law you guys brought up as justification? Smoking? Was it well we know it’s dangerous but 8 year olds can still smoke for a few more years? Or anyone over 10 doesn’t need a seatbelt until 198…..
 
Whoa . The discussion is about prohibiting tackle football for kids under 12 in California ! You are off the rails ! And trying to derail this thread
How am I off the rails. You have a state who says puberty blockers are ok but football isn’t. It’s the same governing body, of course it’s relevant. It shows that it’s about their belief system and not rooted in science. Again, post the data. Prove why this law is needed.
 
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How am I off the rails. You have a state who says puberty blockers are ok but football isn’t. It’s the same governing body, of course it’s relevant. It shows that it’s about their belief system and not rooted in science. Again, post the data. Prove why this law is needed.
Ok so every state law and proposed state law in California is relevant to this discussion according to your logic ? Maybe you took too many tackles to the head at 9 !
 
The pre 12 crap is just that, crap. I hurt my head more playing wiffleball, rolling down a hill in a tire, bike riding etc more than I ever did with a 90 lb kid running 7 miles an hour.
Now- the full honestly on my part- I would have my kids all play tackle at that age but if I ever had another who looked like they could be elite- I would shut them down as college and pro sports just aren’t worth it to 90% of the kids out there. It is the older ages doing all the damage. And that is the full body, not just the head.
 
Ok so every state law and proposed state law in California is relevant to this discussion according to your logic ? Maybe you took too many tackles to the head at 9 !
Every law. No. But when you say puberty blockers and sex surgery are safe and football isn’t then yea it is.

  • Boys’ ice hockey: 23%
  • Girls’ lacrosse: 21%
  • Cheerleading: 20%
  • Boys’ lacrosse: 17%
  • Football: 17%
  • Girls’ soccer: 15%
Those are stats. Where are laws to ban cheer

And that’s before you look at the fact that many concussion Dx are BS. Pediatricians simply aren’t up to date. That’s not my opinion. That’s coming from a renowned specialist in NJ. Not only are most mis diagnosed the treatment protocols are rarely up to date. Anybody who has ever coached knows there is an acclimation period. One year, we had our first practice on a Thursday. Helmets only, no contact, really nothing except calisthenics and an explanation of what’s to come. Next practice was Monday. Monday 12 kids showed up in “concussion protocol”. Why? Because they had never worn a helmet, it was 90 degrees out, and after practice they told mommy their head hurt. Mommy called pediatrician and said little Johnny complained about his head hurting after football. Well mist be a concussion. He’s done for 4 weeks. But he can still go to school, use his phone, and play x box.
 
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The pre 12 crap is just that, crap. I hurt my head more playing wiffleball, rolling down a hill in a tire, bike riding etc more than I ever did with a 90 lb kid running 7 miles an hour.
Now- the full honestly on my part- I would have my kids all play tackle at that age but if I ever had another who looked like they could be elite- I would shut them down as college and pro sports just aren’t worth it to 90% of the kids out there. It is the older ages doing all the damage. And that is the full body, not just the head.
yep, it’s a violent game.
 
The world doesn’t revolve around football. Let kids learn gaming, guitar, fencing, pottery making, whatever. A thousand years ago gladiators fought lions, and then this ‘sport’ died out. By feel. The world survived. People chose other activities instead.
Jesus! Why the hell are you even on a football board? Shouldn't you be on a knitting or pottery board instead of supporting the activity you believe should be vanquished? And gaming, really! So, sitting on a couch in front of a TV all day is healthy physically and mentally to you?
 
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yep, it’s a violent game.
Interesting thing about the violence- we see and hear the big hits and injuries- but at 40/50- it ends up being the mult little taps 70 plays a game that do the real damage. Take an OL- at tge high levels a starter is in 70 plays a game. Each play is about 7-8 seconds of baseball bats and hammers hitting you from all angles.
 
Jesus! Why the hell are you even on a football board? Shouldn't you be on a knitting or pottery board instead of supporting the activity you believe should be vanquished? And gaming, reallly! So, sitting on a couch in front of a TV all day is healthy physically and mentally to you?
He’s a Penn state fan. Maybe he equates all youth football to kids getting raped?
 
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Except there is nothing sensible about the law because it’s based on feelings and not data. If it’s so dangerous why are they doing it gradually? Shouldn’t it be a hard stop? Did we gradually impose the seat belt law you guys brought up as justification? Smoking? Was it well we know it’s dangerous but 8 year olds can still smoke for a few more years? Or anyone over 10 doesn’t need a seatbelt until 198…..
Gradual so the knuckledragging Neanderthal idiots who already have their kids playing tackle at age 5 don’t lose their minds and buy assault rifles and storm Sacramento.
 
The pre 12 crap is just that, crap. I hurt my head more playing wiffleball, rolling down a hill in a tire, bike riding etc more than I ever did with a 90 lb kid running 7 miles an hour.
Now- the full honestly on my part- I would have my kids all play tackle at that age but if I ever had another who looked like they could be elite- I would shut them down as college and pro sports just aren’t worth it to 90% of the kids out there. It is the older ages doing all the damage. And that is the full body, not just the head.
You make good points. As a youth I got knocked out riding my bike (crashed into a telephone pole), playing sandlot baseball (a thrown bat after a strikeout) and backyard football (from hard tackle on me while wearing a helmet and pads).

But CA isn’t talking about outlawing tackle football. Kids will still play it just as I did, with their friends. Maybe it isn’t a bad thing to get the “adults” out of it and let the kids be kids. Just look at how many adults on Social Media who don‘t even live in CA or have young boys are up in arms over this.
 
People on this board are ridiculous Why don’t you ask pop warner coaches what they think ? That’s what I did. I have spoken to 2 friends about this now and both think it’s a good idea. And these are people that played collegiate and had their own kids start tackling at 8.
I am sure there will be coaches and parents against this too . But I was really surprised when these guys told me it’s a good idea to start tackling later.
To be honest how many Pop Warner coaches are actually competent to instruct proper techniques., safety , strength and conditioning since it starts there or should be introduced to the players. How many have undergone evaluations and testing by qualified people. Also because you played high school - college level does not qualify you to instruct young players. Sure you have an idea but also a personal feeling is intertwined in your coaching philosophy. Football is a dangerous sport more so than ever. What is the physical difference between 10-12? Some 10’s are more developed and talented than some older. That has always been true. Do any of you play at age 9-10 against 12-13 year olds? Most here probably have and yes in Pop Warner. At age 10 I was taller. stronger, more physically gifted and too heavy for the 120 lb. 126- lb limit. And no I wasn’t a fatty… it should discussed but not mandated. Mandated has now become the” In Thing”.
 
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To be honest how many Pop Warner coaches are actually competent to instruct proper techniques., safety , strength and conditioning since it starts there or should be introduced to the players. How many have undergone evaluations and testing by qualified people. Also because you played high school - college level does not qualify you to instruct young players. Sure you have an idea but also a personal feeling is intertwined in your coaching philosophy. Football is a dangerous sport more so than ever. What is the physical difference between 10-12? Some 10’s are more developed and talented than some older. That has always been true. Do any of you play at age 9-10 against 12-13 year olds? Most here probably have and yes in Pop Warner. At age 10 I was taller. stronger, more physically gifted and too heavy for the 120 lb. 126- lb limit. And no I wasn’t a fatty… it should discussed but not mandated. Mandated has now become the” In Thing”.
Yep you’re right. And you have lots of these coaches that you say don’t know how to teach tackling properly to 8 and 9 year old kids. Not a good situation
 
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So you need to ban hockey, lax, and rugby as well. Let California worry about childhood gender studies and surgery and let everyone parent their own kids. And no there is no data saying youth football is an issue. In fact, data says there are way more concussions in soccer

There’s actually a wealth of data out there on this.

Just because you don’t look doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.
 
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...field hockey, basketball, hell - stairs and bathrooms too.

All involve an increased risk of head injury.
Comparing tackle football to bathrooms is a new milestone for this board.

Don’t know what kind of bathrooms you’re going to
 
Two things I know

1. I’m glad it was alive during the days when kids were allowed to be kids, before everything was recorded, before helicopter, parents were completely over the top, before social media took over and before this new age of everybody wins a trophy.

2. I hope to God I’m not around anymore if they ever do ban tackle football, it’s a huge part of my life and something I am very passionate about.

If god forbid the future of football resembles anything like the pro bowl, I would blow my nuts off
 
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Well, this thread brought out a lot of the CE board crazies and it went off topic
Yep and the right wing nut moderators allow it.

Hey not everything is bad in America.

-The stock market is at all time highs

- unemployment is near record lows

-the US is energy independent with record oil and nat gas production

-mortgages rates are going back down

- inflation is going back down

- no terrorist attacks since Jan 6 2021
 
Except there is nothing sensible about the law because it’s based on feelings and not data. If it’s so dangerous why are they doing it gradually? Shouldn’t it be a hard stop? Did we gradually impose the seat belt law you guys brought up as justification? Smoking? Was it well we know it’s dangerous but 8 year olds can still smoke for a few more years? Or anyone over 10 doesn’t need a seatbelt until 198…..
Getting a bill passed sometimes involves compromises. The recent compromise to change to gradual implementation over the next 5 years allows more youths who are already playing organized tackle football to continue playing, which softens the bill slightly and increases the chance of the bill being passed, at least in the eyes of the bill sponsors.
 
Yep and the right wing nut moderators allow it.

Hey not everything is bad in America.

-The stock market is at all time highs

- unemployment is near record lows

-the US is energy independent with record oil and nat gas production

-mortgages rates are going back down

- inflation is going back down

- no terrorist attacks since Jan 6 2021

Whine much?

Feel free to leave
 
Every law. No. But when you say puberty blockers and sex surgery are safe and football isn’t then yea it is.

  • Boys’ ice hockey: 23%
  • Girls’ lacrosse: 21%
  • Cheerleading: 20%
  • Boys’ lacrosse: 17%
  • Football: 17%
  • Girls’ soccer: 15%
Those are stats. Where are laws to ban cheer

And that’s before you look at the fact that many concussion Dx are BS. Pediatricians simply aren’t up to date. That’s not my opinion. That’s coming from a renowned specialist in NJ. Not only are most mis diagnosed the treatment protocols are rarely up to date. Anybody who has ever coached knows there is an acclimation period. One year, we had our first practice on a Thursday. Helmets only, no contact, really nothing except calisthenics and an explanation of what’s to come. Next practice was Monday. Monday 12 kids showed up in “concussion protocol”. Why? Because they had never worn a helmet, it was 90 degrees out, and after practice they told mommy their head hurt. Mommy called pediatrician and said little Johnny complained about his head hurting after football. Well mist be a concussion. He’s done for 4 weeks. But he can still go to school, use his phone, and play x box.

You are acting like they pulled this out of thin air. This is not a new concept - limiting tackle football to certain ages. US Soccer bans heading for 10 and under and I believe there are limits for certain leagues for 10-12 year olds.

Pediatrics, the newsletter for the American Academy of Pediatrics has weighed in on this saying there might be benefits to limiting tackle to certain ages. They also conducted a poll of parents and over 60% would support limitations on tackling and another 24% answered that they probably would support limits.

Former NFL players have also lined up against this saying tackling should be limited to those 12 or older. Two NFL Hall of Famers, Harry Carson and Nick Buoninconti before his deathteamed up with Boston U to work on research and push an initiative to limit tackle football to older children.

This bothers you, mostly, because of one factor. It's California that is doing this.
 
If this keeps young kids playing some form of football, I think it may be a good thing. Parents are increasingly reluctant to allow their grade school aged kids to play full contact football. And that may eventually choke off the sport.
 
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Yep you’re right. And you have lots of these coaches that you say don’t know how to teach tackling properly to 8 and 9 year old kids. Not a good situation
I’m all for teaching flag and tackle football … that 7-9-10 year old is not going to cause serious injury … more serious injuries biking, skate boarding , and any number of sports for young kids. It is the responsibility of the parents to decide for their children not some politician , school board member or other outsider. Wonder if Gavin played football?
 
You are acting like they pulled this out of thin air. This is not a new concept - limiting tackle football to certain ages. US Soccer bans heading for 10 and under and I believe there are limits for certain leagues for 10-12 year olds.

Pediatrics, the newsletter for the American Academy of Pediatrics has weighed in on this saying there might be benefits to limiting tackle to certain ages. They also conducted a poll of parents and over 60% would support limitations on tackling and another 24% answered that they probably would support limits.

Former NFL players have also lined up against this saying tackling should be limited to those 12 or older. Two NFL Hall of Famers, Harry Carson and Nick Buoninconti before his deathteamed up with Boston U to work on research and push an initiative to limit tackle football to older children.

This bothers you, mostly, because of one factor. It's California that is doing this.
Then ban all sports where injury is possible. Biking, skate boards, lacrosse, roller blading… stupidity by the stupid. Everything has an injury risk… actually this is more about ability to control than concern for injury to a 8-9-10 up to high school.
 
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I’m all for teaching flag and tackle football … that 7-9-10 year old is not going to cause serious injury … more serious injuries biking, skate boarding , and any number of sports for young kids. It is the responsibility of the parents to decide for their children not some politician , school board member or other outsider. Wonder if Gavin played football?

I saw one proposal that limited full tackling to 7th and 8th grade levels (or weight classes). The younger kids would get tackling training but games would be flag and focus on teaching football concepts, positioning, etc. Then when they got to 7th or 8th (or the proper weight class), they'd have been exposed to tackling drills but that would be the first time they could then hit in games.
 
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If this keeps young kids playing some form of football, I think it may be a good thing. Parents are increasingly reluctant to allow their grade school aged kids to play full contact football. And that may eventually choke off the sport.
Where I live in California “Friday Night Lights” flag football is huge. Played year round, though junior high. All of the other sports leagues avoid scheduling anything on Fridays as a result. The interest in football isn’t going anywhere here.
 
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Then ban all sports where injury is possible. Biking, skate boards, lacrosse, roller blading… stupidity by the stupid. Everything has an injury risk… actually this is more about ability to control than concern for injury to a 8-9-10 up to high school.

You can't even try to rationalize with people like yourself. This isn't new in youth sports. As I said the no heading thing has been around for years. Youth baseball has limitations on baseball bats. Based on the league, you have to be a certain age to being wearing metal cleats.

You have NFL Hall of Famers advocating for some restrictions but RUBOB72 knows better. LOL.

Not everything is some weird "they want to control your lives" conspiracy. Limitations in youth sports like this is not new.
 
No but they’ll allow their children to spend endless hours on their phones, I-pads etc . Both have chance of destroying the mind under that type thinking. How soon before Murphy and Hochul hop on the Newsome push on this tackle football issue. Wait until the lawsuits 10-15 years down the road claim “ they ruined my chances for NIL and scholarship $$$$. “ They’ll always be a lawyer ready to file .
 
No but they’ll allow their children to spend endless hours on their phones, I-pads etc . Both have chance of destroying the mind under that type thinking. How soon before Murphy and Hochul hop on the Newsome push on this tackle football issue. Wait until the lawsuits 10-15 years down the road claim “ they ruined my chances for NIL and scholarship $$$$. “ They’ll always be a lawyer ready to file .

Again, limiting tackling to kids 12 and older isn't some concept someone just brought up yesterday. Harry Carson, for example, has been advocating this for years and in 2018 was part of a program to push for limitations in youth football.

And anyone that files a lawsuit because of NIL or whatever other BS because they couldn't tackle until they were in 6th or 7th grade will get laughed out of court. So I don't think we should be too worried about an influx of lawsuits.
 
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