OT: Electric vehicles

[mildone]

In and out of the dealership in 15 minutes. Amazing first drive out on the highway. Have a lot to learn about the features but it is very user friendly.

Were you nervous driving it home? Did you do a bunch of 0-60 launches on the way home? Or does a Model 3, like other cars, have a recommended break-in period that prohibits that kind of load on the motor until the car's broken in?

I'm always a little nervous when first driving a new car home. Mostly because of my firm belief in the pervasive power of tragicomic irony. I fully expect an 18 wheeler to crush me right as I exit the dealership lot. That it hasn't happened to me yet in no way reduces that expectation with each new car.

 

[LBusDoor90]

Takes a little while to get used to not using the brake.

Yes, for 3 days, I was infuriating people behind me by stopping 20 feet short of all stop signs and red lights.

 

[mildone]

Takes a little while to get used to not using the brake.

You're probably going to get irrationally angry for reasons that I won't understand at this question, but I'm going to ask it anyway...

I'm wondering if, once getting used to letting the car do most of the braking, you experience a momentary adjustment period when driving a car w/out regenerative braking? Like a rental car, for example. Where you forget, briefly, that you actually have to use the brake.

When I switch from a car w/a clutch to an automatic, and haven't driven an automatic for a long time, I have to fight the urge to stomp on the brake pedal with my left (clutch) foot. I've actually done that (stomped on the brake w/my left foot) a couple times, when younger. It's a muscle memory thing, that I've learned to work around by always tucking my left foot as far away from the pedals as possible until I get used to the lack of clutch. This is exacerbated somewhat by my occasionally, when engaging in very high speed driving in an automatic, using left-foot braking which is a lot faster than single-foot braking.

The clutch/no-clutch thing is pretty common, I've seen many people talk about it over the years. So I would guess the switch from not having to brake to braking could be a similar thing.

At least the braking thing would most likely be caught quickly without a lot of fanfare (if paying attention, the driver will sense the lack of immediate slowing and remember to brake). Whereas the stomping on the brake like it's a clutch thing can lead to a pretty violent reminder not to do that. LOL

 

[Scarlet16E]

Question:
If you're not using the brakes, because of the e-vehicle's regenerative braking, do the vehicle's brake-lights illuminate when it is decelerating in this way? I'm hoping they do as it could otherwise lead to an oblivious driver behind you slamming into your rear.

 

[mildone]

Yes, for 3 days, I was infuriating people behind me by stopping 20 feet short of all stop signs and red lights.

So... if you ease off the brake, does your car creep forward on idle like a traditional automatic? And... if you initially use the brakes and find yourself slowing too quickly, can you ease off the brakes and allow the car to maintain some momentum and then reapply the brakes to stop the car?

 

[mildone]

Question:
If you're not using the brakes, because of the e-vehicle's regenerative braking, do the vehicle's brake-lights illuminate when it is decelerating in this way? I'm hoping they do as it could otherwise lead to an oblivious driver behind you slamming into your rear.

Good question.

As an analogy, I use engine braking a lot and have, at times, found that I need to tap the brakes to wake up the driver behind me. I also find that if I'm sitting at a red light on a level road and release the brakes, cars behind me will start to go before realizing I'm not actually moving - a Pavlovian response by drivers who instinctively recognize the brake lights going out as an invalid cue that the light has changed to green.

 

[Scarlet16E]

Second question:
I'm wondering why they would engineer the controls the way that's being described.
It sounds like if you take your foot of the accelerator pedal, that it immediately begins regenerative braking. That sounds pretty annoying to me (maybe just me).
Why wouldn't they engineer it to roll freely (as if in neutral in an ICE car) and only begin regenerative braking when you first touch the brake pedal. Then add actual mechanical braking only when the brake pedal is more forcefully pressed?

Serious question.

 

[LBusDoor90]

Question:
If you're not using the brakes, because of the e-vehicle's regenerative braking, do the vehicle's brake-lights illuminate when it is decelerating in this way? I'm hoping they do as it could otherwise lead to an oblivious driver behind you slamming into your rear.

Yes. They come on anytime there is any significant slowing.

 

[LBusDoor90]

So... if you ease off the brake, does your car creep forward on idle like a traditional automatic? And... if you initially use the brakes and find yourself slowing too quickly, can you ease off the brakes and allow the car to maintain some momentum and then reapply the brakes to stop the car?

You can set it to creep like ICE cars but I don’t know anyone that uses it. The great advantage to me is instead turning on “hold” so that when regen braking reaches 0 mph, it will hold the car in place without having to press the brake pedal. Hence, the lengthy discussion we had in the old thread about how infrequently we use our brakes.
For your second question, the regen and brake combo will likely bring you to a stop early. But it doesn’t take long to realize how you just need to stop using the brake over long predictable stopping distances.

 

[LBusDoor90]

You're probably going to get irrationally angry for reasons that I won't understand at this question, but I'm going to ask it anyway...

I'm wondering if, once getting used to letting the car do most of the braking, you experience a momentary adjustment period when driving a car w/out regenerative braking? Like a rental car, for example. Where you forget, briefly, that you actually have to use the brake.

When I switch from a car w/a clutch to an automatic, and haven't driven an automatic for a long time, I have to fight the urge to stomp on the brake pedal with my left (clutch) foot. I've actually done that (stomped on the brake w/my left foot) a couple times, when younger. It's a muscle memory thing, that I've learned to work around by always tucking my left foot as far away from the pedals as possible until I get used to the lack of clutch. This is exacerbated somewhat by my occasionally, when engaging in very high speed driving in an automatic, using left-foot braking which is a lot faster than single-foot braking.

The clutch/no-clutch thing is pretty common, I've seen many people talk about it over the years. So I would guess the switch from not having to brake to braking could be a similar thing.

At least the braking thing would most likely be caught quickly without a lot of fanfare (if paying attention, the driver will sense the lack of immediate slowing and remember to brake). Whereas the stomping on the brake like it's a clutch thing can lead to a pretty violent reminder not to do that. LOL

Yes, but it’s only momentary as the old wiring in my brain kicks in as I think “oh yeah, coasting again”.
We actually face this whenever our batteries are near a 100% charge or in extremely cold conditions. Our monitor warns us before we drive that regen braking is temporarily unavailable because there’s no place for the juice it creates to be stored or the extreme cold is making the created juice incapable of being stored until the system warms up.

 

[LBusDoor90]

Second question:
I'm wondering why they would engineer the controls the way that's being described.
It sounds like if you take your foot of the accelerator pedal, that it immediately begins regenerative braking. That sounds pretty annoying to me (maybe just me).
Why wouldn't they engineer it to roll freely (as if in neutral in an ICE car) and only begin regenerative braking when you first touch the brake pedal. Then add actual mechanical braking only when the brake pedal is more forcefully pressed?

Serious question.

You can turn off the regen. But having your car’s kinetic energy immediately turned into stored chemical potential energy in the batteries (instead of wasted heat on brake pads) is such a huge benefit in lowering our Wh/mi consumption that (again) no one I know turns it off. After a few days, regen becomes second nature and not annoying at all.

 

[mildone]

You can set it to creep like ICE cars but I don’t know anyone that uses it. The great advantage to me is instead turning on “hold” so that when regen braking reaches 0 mph, it will hold the car in place without having to press the brake pedal. Hence, the lengthy discussion we had in the old thread about how infrequently we use our brakes.
For your second question, the regen and brake combo will likely bring you to a stop early. But it doesn’t take long to realize how you just need to stop using the brake over long predictable stopping distances.

I'm not entirely sure, but if the car allowed it, I think I would want to set things up to give me the greatest amount of control over braking. I have avoided being rear ended a couple times by always being alert and by using a combination of braking and acceleration. Which, if I'm understanding it correctly, would be difficult to do right unless I had full control over the braking.

But maybe not. Might be more natural than I'm thinking.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

You're probably going to get irrationally angry for reasons that I won't understand at this question, but I'm going to ask it anyway...

I'm wondering if, once getting used to letting the car do most of the braking, you experience a momentary adjustment period when driving a car w/out regenerative braking? Like a rental car, for example. Where you forget, briefly, that you actually have to use the brake.

When I switch from a car w/a clutch to an automatic, and haven't driven an automatic for a long time, I have to fight the urge to stomp on the brake pedal with my left (clutch) foot. I've actually done that (stomped on the brake w/my left foot) a couple times, when younger. It's a muscle memory thing, that I've learned to work around by always tucking my left foot as far away from the pedals as possible until I get used to the lack of clutch. This is exacerbated somewhat by my occasionally, when engaging in very high speed driving in an automatic, using left-foot braking which is a lot faster than single-foot braking.

The clutch/no-clutch thing is pretty common, I've seen many people talk about it over the years. So I would guess the switch from not having to brake to braking could be a similar thing.

At least the braking thing would most likely be caught quickly without a lot of fanfare (if paying attention, the driver will sense the lack of immediate slowing and remember to brake). Whereas the stomping on the brake like it's a clutch thing can lead to a pretty violent reminder not to do that. LOL

There are some mental adjustments when going back to an ice car. The lack of braking when you take your foot off the accelerator is different, as is the lack of instant acceleration.

 

[mildone]

Yes, but it’s only momentary as the old wiring in my brain kicks in as I think “oh yeah, coasting again”.
We actually face this whenever our batteries are near a 100% charge or in extremely cold conditions. Our monitor warns us before we drive that regen braking is temporarily unavailable because there’s no place for the juice it creates to be stored or the extreme cold is making the created juice incapable of being stored until the system warms up.

That makes sense. I figure the periodic battery full manual braking requirement is probably a good thing, if for no other reason than it keeps the brake pedal instinct alive.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

So... if you ease off the brake, does your car creep forward on idle like a traditional automatic? And... if you initially use the brakes and find yourself slowing too quickly, can you ease off the brakes and allow the car to maintain some momentum and then reapply the brakes to stop the car?

There is no creeping forward in an EV like idle in an ICE car. If your foot is off the accelerator, the regen kicks in, so you're going to stop eventually. Add in the brake (even easing off) and you will come to stop even more quickly.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Question:
If you're not using the brakes, because of the e-vehicle's regenerative braking, do the vehicle's brake-lights illuminate when it is decelerating in this way? I'm hoping they do as it could otherwise lead to an oblivious driver behind you slamming into your rear.

Yes, the brake lights come on during regen.

 

[LBusDoor90]

I'm not entirely sure, but if the car allowed it, I think I would want to set things up to give me the greatest amount of control over braking. I have avoided being rear ended a couple times by always being alert and by using a combination of braking and acceleration. Which, if I'm understanding it correctly, would be difficult to do right unless I had full control over the braking.

But maybe not. Might be more natural than I'm thinking.

We use our brakes and accelerators in emergency situations like that just like everyone else. The moment you hit the accelerator, there of course is no more regen slowing in the case of inattentive morons playing with their phones I think you are likely referring to. The great advantage is simply that you have regen and the brakes working together in all slowing situations.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

You can set it to creep like ICE cars but I don’t know anyone that uses it. The great advantage to me is instead turning on “hold” so that when regen braking reaches 0 mph, it will hold the car in place without having to press the brake pedal. Hence, the lengthy discussion we had in the old thread about how infrequently we use our brakes.
For your second question, the regen and brake combo will likely bring you to a stop early. But it doesn’t take long to realize how you just need to stop using the brake over long predictable stopping distances.

I forgot that you can set the car to creep. I don't use that at all. I love knowing that when the car is stopped, it is stopped. It's like being in park when stopped, but since there are no gears, you can instantly drive when the accelerator is depressed.

 

[mildone]

We use our brakes and accelerators in emergency situations like that just like everyone else. The moment you hit the accelerator, there of course is no more regen slowing in the case of inattentive morons playing with their phones I think you are likely referring to. The great advantage is simply that you have regen and the brakes working together in all slowing situations.

Gotcha.

Well, I should be pretty well prepared for regen-braking when I get my first EV due to not using my brakes very much under normal driving conditions (in manual cars) today. On the negative side, it has occurred to me that my habit of using engine braking puts a lot of wear on my engine, the replacement of which dwarfs the cost of even the most expensive brake pads. Hm.

 

[LBusDoor90]

I forgot that you set the car to creep. I don't use that at all. I love knowing that when the car is stopped, it is stopped. It's like being in park when stopped, but since there are no gears, you can instantly drive when the accelerator is depressed.

I used it briefly at the start thinking I'd miss it. But then I loved knowing I simply didn't need to leave my foot on the brake anymore.
Then the "hold" feature came with a software update about a year ago and yes, being able to sit at a light with my foot already on the accelerator is AWESOME, buying me a half second of extra time (as they go from brake to acc) to get away from an erratic driver sitting next to me. It is my favorite software update feature so far.

 

[LBusDoor90]

Gotcha.

Well, I should be pretty well prepared for regen-braking when I get my first EV due to not using my brakes very much under normal driving conditions (in manual cars) today. On the negative side, it has occurred to me that my habit of using engine braking puts a lot of wear on my engine, the replacement of which dwarfs the cost of even the most expensive brake pads. Hm.

Understood but don't forget there are only about 20 moving parts in our cars and many are not in contact with each other since it's all about magnetic fields to get them to move.
I hear you though - when I got my first automatic, I missed my manual `91 Escort and at times, felt bored. The shifting involved in accelerating and downshifting when slowing was fun and something I considered an art when trying to perfect both.

 

[Rutgers Chris]

Were you nervous driving it home? Did you do a bunch of 0-60 launches on the way home? Or does a Model 3, like other cars, have a recommended break-in period that prohibits that kind of load on the motor until the car's broken in?

I'm always a little nervous when first driving a new car home. Mostly because of my firm belief in the pervasive power of tragicomic irony. I fully expect an 18 wheeler to crush me right as I exit the dealership lot. That it hasn't happened to me yet in no way reduces that expectation with each new car.

Absolutely launched on my way home a few times on the highway, it seems beyond mandatory. I wasn’t too nervous but it sure is a different experience. The brake definitely takes getting a little used to, but I think I’m almost there.

 

[mildone]

This thread, or maybe the old one, has touched on the idea of battery swaps. This prototype is pretty cool:

The Best New Electric Car Is A Tiny Little Beast That Can Swap Batteries In 3 Minutes

The City One looks like a cross between a Honda Element, Citroën 2CV, and a Halliburton Briefcase

jalopnik.com

Not a fan of calling it the “best new electric”, but journalists like to foster divisiveness to drive views.

 

[fsg2]

This thread, or maybe the old one, has touched on the idea of battery swaps. This prototype is pretty cool:

The Best New Electric Car Is A Tiny Little Beast That Can Swap Batteries In 3 Minutes

The City One looks like a cross between a Honda Element, Citroën 2CV, and a Halliburton Briefcase

jalopnik.com

Not a fan of calling it the “best new electric”, but journalists like to foster divisiveness to drive views.

Especially jalopnik.

 

[RUevolution36]

Cool use of electrification...electric turbos?

Mercedes-Benz swings for the fences with its 831-horsepower AMG GT 63 S E Performance hybrid

The Mercdes-AMG GT 63 S E Performance packs 831 horsepower and 1033 pound-feet of torque thanks to a new hybrid V8 powertrain.

www.autoblog.com

 

[fsg2]

Electric turbos are pretty slick, eliminating turbo's main downside. That AMG one looks like an uprated version of the ones Mercedes has had out for a couple years. Audi has its own, too.

 

[RUBlackout]

I'm in the market for an SUV. But I'm holding off because (a) I don't actually need one, I just want one - so there's no hurry and (b) it's a pure seller's market for SUVs of all kinds right now, so it makes sense to wait on the market to become more neutral or even favorable for buyers.

I'm kind of leaning towards a Macan S or GTS right now. Although, while I've cooled on it slightly, every time I see a Telluride, I want one. Kia hit that one out of the park. I could easily wind up with one of those for which my bank account would thank me.

If you want an EV SUV, and you like the Macans, you might want to wait for the Macan EV to come out. I think it's due as a 2023 model, so sometime in 2022. Or consider the Audi e-Tron (SUV, not GT).

Thank you for this...good to know in the EV Macan

And you are 100% right on Kia. I think they have really come a long way and created a great SUV and cars along with their new logo.

 

[RUevolution36]

Biden infrastructure plan takes on EV charging’s inequality problem

The Biden administration has an ambitious $7.5 billion plan to expand electric vehicle charging to underserved areas.

www.autoblog.com

 

[RUevolution36]

Another cool advancement in green car tech.

Mercedes-Benz and SSAB explore fossil fuel-free steel for cars

SSAB plans to supply fossil-free steel at a commercial scale in 2026 using the hydrogen HYBRIT system to replace coking coal typically used in steelmaking.

www.autoblog.com

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Picking up my Model 3 this morning. Can’t wait

Congratulations! SR+, LR, or Performance?

And 1 pedal driving is one of the favorite features of my model 3. You're going to love it.

 

[Rutgers Chris]

Congratulations! SR+, LR, or Performance?

And 1 pedal driving is one of the favorite features of my model 3. You're going to love it.

Long Range. Will work out the kinks on this one and upgrade the S-plaid soon enough lol

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Another cool advancement in green car tech.

Mercedes-Benz and SSAB explore fossil fuel-free steel for cars

SSAB plans to supply fossil-free steel at a commercial scale in 2026 using the hydrogen HYBRIT system to replace coking coal typically used in steelmaking.

www.autoblog.com

A really interesting-sounding innovation. If it understand this, hydrogen fuel cells will be used to generate electricity, replacing coal plants.

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Long Range. Will work out the kinks on this one and upgrade the S-plaid soon enough lol

We're thinking on the same wavelength. Good luck

 

[RUevolution36]

are EV's more or less tolerant to driving thru lightly flooded roadways?

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

are EV's more or less tolerant to driving thru lightly flooded roadways?

 

[mdk01]

View embedded media

Thrust via wheel rotation while floating? Don't think the "mileage" would be very good using that method of propulsion. And if you're floating, that means you have current issues, which we all saw yesterday.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Also this. There are also a bunch of videos of Tesla M3s driving through flooded streets in China available online.

 

[mdk01]

Also this. There are also a bunch of videos of Tesla M3s driving through flooded streets in China available online.

View embedded media

They don't appear to be floating

 

[ashokan]

Just making it through the water doesn't mean you're ok.

 

[fsg2]

are EV's more or less tolerant to driving thru lightly flooded roadways?

Depends.

A Tiny Electric Car That’s Waterproof and Floats | February 2019 | Highlighting Japan

www.gov-online.go.jp

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