I stand corrected although you are incorrect in 2014. The Navy away game was neutral. ND never goes to Annapolis. They always play their road game with Navy at a large neutral site venue. But I still stand by my basic premis which is that ND makes too much money to join a conference and will sacrifice their chances at a NC in order to keep the money flowing.
B12 Expansion
- Thread starter MozRU
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I stand corrected although you are incorrect in 2014. The Navy away game was neutral. ND never goes to Annapolis. They always play their road game with Navy at a large neutral site venue. But I still stand by my basic premis which is that ND makes too much money to join a conference and will sacrifice their chances at a NC in order to keep the money flowing.
They were also informed that men have walked on the moon.
If this is true, then it appears that some decisions are being made and, perhaps, there is a short list of schools that will be vetted. I doubt such a list will be announced, though, as doing so would only complicate matters for any schools on the list that end up not being selected by the B12.
Yes, isn't that sort of like any of us tweeting that we are no longer candidates to date Ashley Graham?
Lots of eyeballs in that Wilson-Greenville-Washington corridor. It rivals Tampa-Orlando-Daytona. Surprised the B12 isn't interested
You can disagree all you want, it's still true. Right now, Notre Dame has a shot at 4 playoff spots, like everyone else. Under the discussed scenario, Notre Dame only has 3 spots, while the P5 schools would have 4. Plus, the P5 schools would only have to compete within their conference for the automatic spot, rather than competing against the entire nation, and the committee wouldn't be a factor in that slot.
Aside from that, it would be a huge disadvantage in recruiting. The P5 schools could sell recruits on a guaranteed path to the playoffs, that doesn't involve the committee, is strictly determined on the field, and has a much larger margin for error (i.e. you don't have to go 12-0/11-1 to get in). You simply aren't being realistic if you think access to the playoffs won't have a major effect on recruiting.
It doesn't matter if you don't get paid for the eyeballs.
They need to stop feeding the delusional temple fans. Hell will freeze over first.
The B12 needs TV sets. Outside of the state of Texas, it has very few of those. Thus, Temple is apparently a contender, along with the two Florida schools. UConn would come in 4th. Those four trump Cincy, ECU, and Memphis in that regard and Houston, of course, adds nothing since the league already has that market sewn up, along with A&M. Hard to figure out exactly what BYU adds other than a strong sports programs and several headaches but it is the biggest sports name in the bunch, followed by UConn.
If the B12 decides just to add two, those schools should either USF or UCF to bring in the Florida market and one from among Cincy, Temple, and UConn to add a travel partner for WVU.
If the B12 decides just to add two, those schools should either USF or UCF to bring in the Florida market and one from among Cincy, Temple, and UConn to add a travel partner for WVU.
I think the problem here is that any market that any non P5 school brings is already controlled by other big name schools. UCF and USF have to contend with UF, FSU and Miami. Cinn has OSU. Temple has Penn State. It's a real gamble if the B12 will make any meaningful impact in those markets. UConn is the only one who has no market competition but I'm not sure their market share is very large.
Unfortunately for uconn conf expansion is driven by FB, and uconn doesn't have a name in FB. Which I personally take delight in:joy:
The only possible downside to expansion is if Temple gets into a P5 conference, otherwise I'll just sit back and watch.
I can't imagine the 200 or 300 tv sets that conn could bring in will offset the share of B12 $$ they'd have to be given, same goes for Temple IMHO. The B12 better be looking somewhere else.
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anon_ivydyf0amkzay
Guest
LOL @ the big dumpster fire and the mirage of exclusivity!
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CSU Survives ‘First Cut’ For Big 12 Conference
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2016/08/31/csu-survives-first-cut-for-big-12-conference/
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2016/08/31/csu-survives-first-cut-for-big-12-conference/
I don't think UConn is a fit for geographic and cultural reasons (same with Temple) but the Hartford-New Haven market is #30 in the nation. Not huge but not small by any means either.
The following first round Big-12 expansion vote score sheet is from an Oklahoma State board; I don't know how accurate/legit/real it is. Some surprising results as you can see!
Northern Illinois is getting lots of support, and is currently #3 after round 1, being only behind the clear leader Cincinnati, and #2 Colorado State!
The big surprise is that we were led to believe over the past few weeks that Texas supported Houston, and Oklahoma supported Cincinnati.... but as you can see, the Longhorns vetoed Houston!
It's pretty clear that the high population B1G states of Ohio and Illinois are popular expansion targets for the Big 12, with Cincinnati being almost a sure thing.
Lovie Smith and Pat Fitzgerald will possibly go ballistic if Northern Illinois is chosen!
83. Cincinnati
63. Colorado State
57. Northern Illinois
56. Connecticut (Tech veto)
52. BYU (OSU, WVU veto)
50. Memphis
46. Boise State (WVU veto)
29. SMU (OU, Texas veto)
29. Houston (OU, OSU, TCU, Texas veto)
24. UCF
13. USF
13. East Carolina (Kansas, KSU veto)
12. Temple
10. Tulane
7. New Mexico (Kansas, KSU veto)
4. Arkansas State
1. San Diego State
1. UNLV
0. Air Force
0. Rice
Vetoes used:
0: Baylor, Iowa State
1: TCU, Tech
2: Kansas, KSU, OU, OSU, Texas, WVU
Interesting stuff!
Northern Illinois is getting lots of support, and is currently #3 after round 1, being only behind the clear leader Cincinnati, and #2 Colorado State!
The big surprise is that we were led to believe over the past few weeks that Texas supported Houston, and Oklahoma supported Cincinnati.... but as you can see, the Longhorns vetoed Houston!
It's pretty clear that the high population B1G states of Ohio and Illinois are popular expansion targets for the Big 12, with Cincinnati being almost a sure thing.
Lovie Smith and Pat Fitzgerald will possibly go ballistic if Northern Illinois is chosen!
83. Cincinnati
63. Colorado State
57. Northern Illinois
56. Connecticut (Tech veto)
52. BYU (OSU, WVU veto)
50. Memphis
46. Boise State (WVU veto)
29. SMU (OU, Texas veto)
29. Houston (OU, OSU, TCU, Texas veto)
24. UCF
13. USF
13. East Carolina (Kansas, KSU veto)
12. Temple
10. Tulane
7. New Mexico (Kansas, KSU veto)
4. Arkansas State
1. San Diego State
1. UNLV
0. Air Force
0. Rice
Vetoes used:
0: Baylor, Iowa State
1: TCU, Tech
2: Kansas, KSU, OU, OSU, Texas, WVU
Interesting stuff!
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It's actually not interesting at all. Tell us your parameters and 99% of us could pick the teams. By all measures cinci is a lock. Going forward...
TV sets? Florida school.
Fans/ history? BYU
Tv and atmosphere? ECU which was axed?????
TV sets? Florida school.
Fans/ history? BYU
Tv and atmosphere? ECU which was axed?????
What is the impact of a "veto" UH had 4-vetos and is on to the next round, air Force with 0 pts on to next round. This looks like a college kid's final twelve where a few names made it just so they feel good. Boise state, lots of support, but not on the lst? Strange process.
If the ACC lets the B12 take Temple they will make permanent the huge void they have in the Balt-NYC market (don't tell me they can add UConn, because their footprint is in the extreme northern suburbs of the NY market).
Hard to imagine the ACC could have had the #1 and #4 media markets "within" their total conference footprint and manage to not get a presence in either city.
Many of the remainder schools can be put into pairs:
AF, CSU, - same state
UConn, Temple - both in northeast
UCF, USF - Florida
Tulane, Rice - Academics
SMU, UH - Texas
BYU, Cincinnati - Best non-Power 5 schools
AF, CSU, - same state
UConn, Temple - both in northeast
UCF, USF - Florida
Tulane, Rice - Academics
SMU, UH - Texas
BYU, Cincinnati - Best non-Power 5 schools
While our odds of an invite are an extreme long shot, as a long suffering alum, I have to say that it's nice that we finally have folks that sit in the athletic office on North Broad that finally "get it". It's a crime that it took 20 + years to figure it out. Hard to tell what the Big 12 wants to do. If it goes to 2, I think UH and Cincy are the front runners. If it really wants to set up an Eastern presence for WVU and go to 7 school divisions, then it could attempt to set up a division consisting of WVU, Cincy, UConn, TU, Kansas, Iowa St and K St. Southern division would still have UT, TT, OU, Ok St, TCU, Baylor and either BYU or Houston.
However it turns out, as I said, kind of refreshing to have some folks realize that although we still have a ton of work in front of us, we've made strides and we aren't "same old TU". Good luck in Seattle.
However it turns out, as I said, kind of refreshing to have some folks realize that although we still have a ton of work in front of us, we've made strides and we aren't "same old TU". Good luck in Seattle.
Icon is going nowhere, that don't add TV, growth, or football. selfishly, I hope they take Houston and cincy
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anon_ivydyf0amkzay
Guest
My hat,
I think Cincy is in and rightfully so. They deserve it. Houston or BYU is likely the other choice. Hard to say about UConn. That's your opinion. They add an academic profile. Maybe the Big 12 wants that. You can't deny what their basketball programs have accomplished. UConn in the Big 12 is actually no worse than BC being in the ACC. If Big 12 eventually wants to expand again, I can see them being very much in the mix.
I think Cincy is in and rightfully so. They deserve it. Houston or BYU is likely the other choice. Hard to say about UConn. That's your opinion. They add an academic profile. Maybe the Big 12 wants that. You can't deny what their basketball programs have accomplished. UConn in the Big 12 is actually no worse than BC being in the ACC. If Big 12 eventually wants to expand again, I can see them being very much in the mix.
Sorry pal but we can't relate to any of that,,,,,:oops:;)
UConn's #1 weakness is proximity to other teams and the Northeast culture (something that works against Temple too). UConn's TV market is larger than Cincy and their overall athletics program is stronger. They've demonstrated a very strong fanbase with their basketball team - something that they could argue will translate to P5 football. But New England and Oklahoma are so vastly different it doesn't make much sense.
Uconn is not AAU, expansion is always 90% about football and 10% cultural fit. Sometimes it is 95% football or even 99% football... So Uconn football is utter sheet and culturally they have zero in common with any school in the Big12 and that includes WVU. Some schools are making a hard push for eastern expansion but I am not sure the rest of the conference agrees with that.
As far as MBB, it is a non-factor for most Power 5 conferences, or we would have never gotten into the Big Ten and the Big Ten is one of the best MBB conference in the country and we still got in, that is how little it matters.
The only exception to this is the ACC which values MBB more than anyone besides the Big East. The ACC is the only conference that would even look at MBB and decide to add a school based on MBB.
Yours and Uconn best shot for a power 5 upgrade is if the ACC goes to 16 after UND leaves.
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Ucon would have to bring value equal to what they would be getting from the B 12, otherwise it's not worth it. Uconn is not a football school. There is no recruiting base, they have no TV market outside the State of CT and they play in a small stadium 25 miles from campus. Why on earth would a major football power like OU or Texas want to play a game in Hartford, Ct? Some of the other candidates at least have a recruiting base and a TV market. On those metrics Temple, Cincy, Houston, BYU and others all score much higher than Uconn.
It doesn't translate at all. Even when they played us in NJ, barely any Uconn fans made the trip. Even when they lucked into a BCS bowl, they sold almost no tickets. Rutgers would have sold 25,000 for that same bowl game. Uconn fans only care about Basketball, they do not support or care about football at all. Their rating are piss poor in the NYC TV market and recruiting in their state just plain stinks. They are less than a handful of Power 5 players from there per year and it is really more like 1-2 per year. The BIG12 doesn't care about basketball as much as the ACC. Besides Kansas, they are a non factor and Kansas doesn't want Uconn. A LOT of schools have to turn down the BIG12 before Uconn gets in.
