If the B1G does an expansion with AAU members from the PAC12, if the SEC ever raids the ACC later (and you would have to figure their prime targets would be Clemson, Miami, and FSU), there would be at least be a lot of pressure on UVA, UNC, Duke and Ga Tech to join the academic super conference and not the football centric super conference.
B1G - expansion candidates
- Thread starter JayDogSmooth
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Nailed it. This is a giant p- contest between Disney ( ABC/ESPN) and FOX. They are doing this because increasingly people only watch games in real time.
Money talks, look at the deal we poached Maryland from. Whether this still makes sense economically, or this is ego, I don't think this waits 10 years because of the ACC agreement. Both corporations have the funds to entice who they want now. Do they have the stomach to part with the money, and fight the legal challenges. To me that is the question.
There is also this thought. Both conferences raid the ACC now, and tell teams like Wake Forest, yeah you have that agreement, now enforce it.
Don't think OSU and Michigan are going anywhere, but i don't think they will be ok being a 2nd tier Conference behind the SEC (assuming 2nd tier is less than 80% of the money that the SEC makes per school).
Unfortunately I see us rocketing toward 2 super conferences. The SEC and BIG, whatever name changes will come. Look at the AFL vs. NFL before the merger. In time this we be the National Championship Game. The best team from those 2 super conferences.
It is great Rutgers recruited so well. That with our market will help us.
It is great Rutgers recruited so well. That with our market will help us.
I can’t verify it, because I can’t remember which conference it was, but I remember reading a while back that one of the conference’s GORs had enforcement language that talked about a 75% vote.
If true, that means that particular conference doesn’t really even have a GOR because if enough members try to leave there aren’t the votes left to enforce it.
Because he was a big meanie who didn't accede to their demands in the middle of a pandemic. And you could imagine the real reason such people have.
More teams in the conference means sharing the money with more teams. By contracting the conferences the big money makers don't have to share with as many schools. That is actually the whole point of this.
ESPN also saves money by only paying OU and Texas SEC money instead of paying 10 schools Big 12 money.
Right now the P5 conferences each get a 50 million+ payout from the college football playoff money whether one of their teams makes it or not. If the playoff expands and their are only 3-4 power conferences, that annual check will be well north of $100 million.
My understanding was Nebraska was booted out on a technicality. They were receiving $$$ from the state for agricultural research which the AAU considered that to be a subsidy and not an actual grant. I do think that any other school to be admitted to the B1G will have to be AAU. That what sets the conference apart and the presidents are more interested in that prestige than sports affiliations.
The other school kicked out with Nebraska was Syracuse.
Looks like what you say probably was the main reason.
I found an old article about it:
A.A.U. Votes to Remove Nebraska-Lincoln - The New York Times
>The university, the state’s flagship, had several factors working against it. Its medical school is under a separate administrative structure, so the research dollars it brings in are not counted by the association. And as a land-grant institution, Nebraska has about a quarter of its faculty involved in agriculture and extension work, and most financing for agricultural research is noncompetitive and so does not count heavily in the group’s ranking.<
https://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/03/education/03aau.html
I think GOR is challengeable.. if they can prove some kind of promises from their TV partners were not met. Even if the schools grant GOR to the conference and the conference sells it as such to ESPN. if ESPN doesn't hold up its end.. is actively working against the interests of the conference.. and the conference will not defend its member schools rights... I would think there has to be a way to get out. Remember.. some schools have balls.. and politicians who work for their interests...
Anything is challengable. Not sure that is really the pertinent issue though. Rather, what is the likelihood any school wants to take on that fight? No one has to date. It would likely be a long, costly and drawn out legal battle. And if an ACC school lost the argument, their downside risk is not something they can overcome (lost media rights for up to 15 years). Obviously it helps the more schools leave at once, which weakens the position of the conference they are leaving and provides some safety in numbers. But show me the list of schools who are eager to go take on that fight on their own. I think you will find it is a pretty short one.
At the end of the day, few contracts ever hold anyone in a relationship they don't want to be in. This will be especially true when the acc gets raided. The remaining schools will be too busy looking for a lifeline themselves to care about collecting money from other schools doing the same. They will not want to pay it either.
At the end of the day, there will be some nominal settlement and the schools will all go wherever they choose to and are wanted. Those that remain will get some payout and it will be over.
From reports I have heard in the ACC market area, many schools are not happy about their TV contract. If you moved to take enough of those schools, I think the GOR would blow up. Similarly to how we built interstates through, over, and around mountain ranges. Are there risk, sure, however the worse case in things like college football, rarely become reality. State Penn had more of a right to get the death penalty than SMU, for lack of institutional control. Instead they received, a relative slap on the wrist. I think looking at challenging GOR is better than settling for Kansas and Iowa State. If GOR was not challengable, why would the talk be Clemson and FSU are talking to the SEC. The BIG dropped the ball on UT and OU, we need to think BIG, to stay BIG.
If enough schools leave, then possibly. If one or two, I don't see it
Interesting, and possibly scary, what Nicole Auerbach said today in the Athletic reportedly. I don't get it, but heard about on sports talk radio. The SEC plans to expand into the 30's, breakaway, and create a mini NFL with a payroll. Any truth, who really knows, that said, the BIG has to smartly go huge here. It is too risky to do anything else.
I think there is a decent chance a GOR is challengeable. For example, did ESPN promise the ACC certain time slots on certain channels that they can’t give them because they have picked up the SEC game of the week and expanded the SEC?
However, the uncertainty of how long it would take to resolve likely keeps the B1G from even trying.
How does anyone here know what the commissioner has or hasn’t done? Lots of assumptions based on nothing except…Well you figure it out.
And, by the way, the commissioner is not the decision-maker. He reports to 14 university presidents.
And, by the way, the commissioner is not the decision-maker. He reports to 14 university presidents.
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If they do this - I think it will backfire in terms of long term following. But who knows.
I agree, I think there would be a huge backlash, however will that matter. It seems nothing except money, matters anymore.
I read that public schools have sovereign immunity as instrumentalities of the state and can’t be sued for damages in a case like this. I have no idea if that’s true. But the larger point is this: these are complex legal matters with lots of angles, and even attorneys with relevant expertise would likely not always agree. If there is enough money on the line in leaving, or they see the ACC imploding and getting out as critical, the schools will be motivated to fight it. And generally contracts like these don’t succeed in keeping people locked in business relationships they don’t want to be in for long periods of time.
I can see that, but I also believe people making big deals like this hate uncertainty, and there is no way of predicting how long the GOR question would take to be resolved in the courts and free a school.
if their medical schools were merged with Nebraska-Lincoln the way that RBHS is counted as part of Rutgers-New Brunswick, then Nebraska-Lincoln would easily be AAU.
A) Notre Dame and anyone......
B) no one
C) UNC and UVA
D) USC & UCLA
E) Oregon and Washington
F) still no one
G) KU and ISU
that it... that's the list...
now spend your real worrying time making sure tOSU/Michagan and Wisconsin don't backdoor screw-us with their own deal.........
B) no one
C) UNC and UVA
D) USC & UCLA
E) Oregon and Washington
F) still no one
G) KU and ISU
that it... that's the list...
now spend your real worrying time making sure tOSU/Michagan and Wisconsin don't backdoor screw-us with their own deal.........
I think the reality is that the devil is in the contractual details and none of us really know what the deal is with the GOR. Maybe it kills a deal maybe it doesn’t. I can say this, there are a lot of panicked people in the ACC looking for a safe harbor.
You even need to respond to his list? Lol. I think he was drunk. Only ND and UNC add anything there
Im not following this side bar either. No idea what they are referring to
Things working in our favor:
1) OSU knows at any point, any conference they’d want to move to will take them. No rush to make a move.
2) OSU and it’s administration have to believe that their long term branding is best positioned by a strong BIG entity existing alongside the SEC rather than by jumping ship. Perhaps most importantly, the primary reasons the BIG serves their interests aren’t tied to contractual obligations that can be negotiated by lawyers.
3) Clemson sits in the polar opposite position from OSU. Culturally they fit well in the SEC. A move would enhance their branding. They have rivals who are a part of the SEC already. Academic reputation / prestige isn’t a factor all. The motivation to stay in the ACC is almost entirely contractual.
4) If Clemson jumps ship, the BIG is well positioned to pick up more attractive teams that would help strength conference branding (which ultimately will be what does or does not keep OSU loyal).
Factors working against us.
1) ESPN doesn’t want the ACC to implode and will do what it can to prevent it.
2) Both the BIG and ACC may not ultimately be able to survive in the long run.
3) Notre Dame is more likely to join the ACC than the BIG.
1) OSU knows at any point, any conference they’d want to move to will take them. No rush to make a move.
2) OSU and it’s administration have to believe that their long term branding is best positioned by a strong BIG entity existing alongside the SEC rather than by jumping ship. Perhaps most importantly, the primary reasons the BIG serves their interests aren’t tied to contractual obligations that can be negotiated by lawyers.
3) Clemson sits in the polar opposite position from OSU. Culturally they fit well in the SEC. A move would enhance their branding. They have rivals who are a part of the SEC already. Academic reputation / prestige isn’t a factor all. The motivation to stay in the ACC is almost entirely contractual.
4) If Clemson jumps ship, the BIG is well positioned to pick up more attractive teams that would help strength conference branding (which ultimately will be what does or does not keep OSU loyal).
Factors working against us.
1) ESPN doesn’t want the ACC to implode and will do what it can to prevent it.
2) Both the BIG and ACC may not ultimately be able to survive in the long run.
3) Notre Dame is more likely to join the ACC than the BIG.
