I've said multiple times I saw the demonstrations as events of likely transmission.
COVID-19 Pandemic: Transmissions, Deaths, Treatments, Vaccines, Interventions and More...
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Again, given the information at that time, it was a sound decision. One with minimal negative effects. Barely worth discussing.
Lucky for you, this is America, so you have the right to be wrong. Enjoy!
:ThumbsUp
Interesting stats from California- makes a case for full opening. https://news.yahoo.com/california-reopen-coronavirus-stats-science-230000221.html
I do know it well, after reading your comments for months in this thread. BOOM!
:)
Its quite clear only one political side is allowed to post here..otherwise they go hysterical
Not as hopeful as I once was with Moderna. They’ve hardly released any details of their trials, and UMRU’s comments the other page about scalability is worrisome,
I've actually never been wrong. This thread or otherwise. So once again, your wrong.
But I have to go to work now. So we will agree this is settled.
Meanwhile back on planet earth........................
We are at 117,000 deaths. The Univ of Washington analytics group that the White House used until it stopped the daily briefings predicts 200,000 deaths by the end of September. Early on I said we would have 250,000 deaths by the end of the year. People said I was crazy.
There can be absolutely zero doubt that the Trump administrations efforts (or lack thereof) will have contributed to the problem. Anybody who tries to seriously debate this is not living in reality.
EVERYBODY who is not psychotic despite whatever politics they hold is praying for a cure or a way to mitigate the severity and mortality of this virus. It isn't like you get to resume going to restaurants or going to the movies, plays, watch sports if you are a Democrat.
Please just state your opinion and let everyone else state theirs.
We are at 117,000 deaths. The Univ of Washington analytics group that the White House used until it stopped the daily briefings predicts 200,000 deaths by the end of September. Early on I said we would have 250,000 deaths by the end of the year. People said I was crazy.
There can be absolutely zero doubt that the Trump administrations efforts (or lack thereof) will have contributed to the problem. Anybody who tries to seriously debate this is not living in reality.
EVERYBODY who is not psychotic despite whatever politics they hold is praying for a cure or a way to mitigate the severity and mortality of this virus. It isn't like you get to resume going to restaurants or going to the movies, plays, watch sports if you are a Democrat.
Please just state your opinion and let everyone else state theirs.
I catch up on this thread about once every other day and the noise to signal ratio is getting way worse. Thank you to those who are posting about scientific advances, or facts on treatment options, or actual DATA on what is happening in places that have opened up earlier than we have in NJ (both the positive and the negative). So far, these fact-based posters make it worthwhile for me and I’m sure several other quiet readers.
I believe it’s perfectly ok to debate when to do what next. But this obsessive blame game?! I haven't been on such boards much and am a newbie to many forms of "social media", but from what I’m seeing, I think it should be called ANTISOCIAL media!
Here are 3 examples of junk:
(1) Someone continually pushing one drug (one that is still enrolling patients in a trial!) who is always on about successful trials for this drug creating a game changer. This is news? Wouldn't that be true for ANY drug with a similar endpoint/goal, of which there are plenty? Let’s wait for facts, eh?
(2) A second makes a blanket statement that CA raised property taxes by 30%, and others pile on with a political agenda. Beyond the obvious question of what this topic has to do with this thread, a simple Google search uncovers that in CA "Under Proposition 13, the annual real estate tax on a parcel of property is limited to 1 percent of its assessed value. This "assessed value," may be increased only by a maximum of 2 percent per year, until and unless the property has a change of ownership." Again, facts?
(3) These absurd one-liner unfunny gamesmanship, when ONE HUNDRED TWENTY THOUSAND people have died from this accursed virus!
Do these dead not deserve some respect from us? Or do we care less because we think they were disproportionately old, in nursing homes, prisons, obese, African American or brown-skinned? To boot, we have an unprecedented economic crisis on hand.
I fully get that this terrible combination can make people more irrational but come on, can we stay on point on this thread and let the people who provide information continue unbaited? I believe they are doing public good.
I apologize for going long and likely even wandering into preachy territory (I actually hate preachiness), so please just consider this message an appeal to post links to support your arguments and to please avoid political or any other posturing.
I believe it’s perfectly ok to debate when to do what next. But this obsessive blame game?! I haven't been on such boards much and am a newbie to many forms of "social media", but from what I’m seeing, I think it should be called ANTISOCIAL media!
Here are 3 examples of junk:
(1) Someone continually pushing one drug (one that is still enrolling patients in a trial!) who is always on about successful trials for this drug creating a game changer. This is news? Wouldn't that be true for ANY drug with a similar endpoint/goal, of which there are plenty? Let’s wait for facts, eh?
(2) A second makes a blanket statement that CA raised property taxes by 30%, and others pile on with a political agenda. Beyond the obvious question of what this topic has to do with this thread, a simple Google search uncovers that in CA "Under Proposition 13, the annual real estate tax on a parcel of property is limited to 1 percent of its assessed value. This "assessed value," may be increased only by a maximum of 2 percent per year, until and unless the property has a change of ownership." Again, facts?
(3) These absurd one-liner unfunny gamesmanship, when ONE HUNDRED TWENTY THOUSAND people have died from this accursed virus!
Do these dead not deserve some respect from us? Or do we care less because we think they were disproportionately old, in nursing homes, prisons, obese, African American or brown-skinned? To boot, we have an unprecedented economic crisis on hand.
I fully get that this terrible combination can make people more irrational but come on, can we stay on point on this thread and let the people who provide information continue unbaited? I believe they are doing public good.
I apologize for going long and likely even wandering into preachy territory (I actually hate preachiness), so please just consider this message an appeal to post links to support your arguments and to please avoid political or any other posturing.
I haven't looked at Ingraham's work, but for the umpteenth time you are misunderstanding what Horowitz is arguing --even though it was spelled out in the first few paragraphs of his article. Or you are simply ignoring it, maybe because it could prove to be valid and therefore you are obsessed with attacking him personally. Either way, not a good look for you.
Oh by the way on June 10 AZ reported 17 covid hospitalizations ...is that a number to panic about?
As is always the case, there is a grain of truth that is hugely distorted by numerous obfuscations of important facts and context. The truth is that new hospitalizations of people coming in for serious coronavirus infections are actually extremely low. What they are actually counting are the extra people coming in for all of the delayed health care caused by the lockdown. But thanks to universal testing in hospitals, they are discovering more asymptomatic cases than ever before, which had nothing to do with the original purpose of the hospital stay. Thus, they are blaming the fallout of the lockdown on the easing of the lockdown!
-Daniel Horowitz: The new panic lie: Increased coronavirus hospitalizations and cases in the southwest (June 12, 2020)
+1
Some of the comments from the CEO are coming across as used car salesman. Seems to be hiding something. We shall see, but many other vaccines are in development.
I've read a few articles that paint him as the next Elizabeth Holmes.
You claim to “hate” ... there’s that word again...so what do you do every other day or several times a week? You come on here and preach to those who have been here much longer...these people post on a wide variety of issues, facts , topics and of course controversy which some abhor because it doesn’t fit with their narrative. I agree there is a great deal of useful information being passed on to the board members. The scientific expertise is quite excellent but when others post anti or differ with the articles or authors opinions...holy crap Batman the shout downs begin and just for clarification Truth , all for the most part have long ago chosen sides politically, socially and philosophically to an extent . I find this quote amusing “ I actually hate preachiness” ... you semi apologize for this long winded piece but I ‘m almost sure you have done this before. You do realize the greatest part is you don’t have to read the posts that offend , bore or perhaps pique your side of hate. But yet sadly you have done exactly what you said you hate” preach”.
This should put the wearing masks in public places to rest.
Two hair stylists at the Springfield. Missouri Great Clips both with COVID-19, exposed 140 customers to the virus. However, both of the stylists and the 140 customers wore masks. The result? Not one of the 140 customers tested positive for COVID.
Case closed.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/06/17/masks-salons-missouri/
Two hair stylists at the Springfield. Missouri Great Clips both with COVID-19, exposed 140 customers to the virus. However, both of the stylists and the 140 customers wore masks. The result? Not one of the 140 customers tested positive for COVID.
Case closed.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/06/17/masks-salons-missouri/
Wrong again. In Feb/March, I was saying I thought it would take ~12 months to have a commercially available vaccine, which was much more aggressive than most experts were saying (most were saying 18 months or more), but by about early April, I moved that to end of 2020, given that we were seeing faster-than-expected vaccine developments worldwide and I've stuck with by the end of the year since then. I've also said it could even be a bit sooner if we take the human challenge approach of exposing vaccinated healthy volunteers, like I think we should (and for possible emergency use).
It only partly backs up your point about other states - unless they just go nuts with reopening without anyone taking any precautions, their spikes should definitely be less than NY/NJ's, but could still be substantial and lead to far more severe illnesses/deaths than I think anyone would want to see. Most of what I wrote was in response to your ridiculous assertion that "lockdowns, social distancing and masks...all failed in NJ, NY and Eastern PA." My point was we essentially had no interventions/responses other than locking down way too late, because we had no testing and had no idea how far up shit's creek we already were with the most explosive exponential growth seen on Earth, so far, with this virus.
For everyone else from here on out, we could easily use testing/tracing/isolating to find and control flare-ups and use mask-wearing and social distancing in public spaces to greatly reduce flare-ups to begin with, such that case/death rates would be minimal, but apart from a few states, we're not taking that path, meaning we're going to continue to have much greater case/death rates than the countries that have controlled their outbreaks - it won't be as bad as the first wave but it'll be much worse than it had to be.
As many know I enjoy Martensen and watch all of his videos. This one left much to be desired. I wish he further explained his stance on dexamethsaone rather than beating around the bush and leaving it up to the viewer to interpret. Basically, he thinks it’s bs. But he needs to clarify why exactly.
I still don’t understand for the life of me why people have an issue wearing masks indoors in public until we get a better understanding of the virus’ mechanics. My mask is comfortable as hell, and if it allows me to safely get back to normalcy until better options are available I’m all for it.
From a man who knows a great deal about both medicine and government,Ron Paul:"There is something else going on here and it is in no way related to public health.
David Stockman,a man who knows a thing or two about numbers, agrees saying that there are no hot spots in Texas.
David Stockman,a man who knows a thing or two about numbers, agrees saying that there are no hot spots in Texas.
He was dead wrong on HCQ and the virus originating from the Wuhan lab, but got the early high transmission/pandemic potential right (which was more important in the big picture), so I'd take what he says with a large grain of NaCl.
You aren’t skeptical at all about the Wuhan lab? I think you’re being a bit rigid in your beliefs, as that still seems very much up in the air. Martensen makes a point to never say he’s sure that it originated from the lab. There’s no concrete evidence of that, just a ton of circumstantial evidence (which makes him, me, and others think that it probably did). His main point is that those saying it 100% couldn’t have come from a lab were doing so in bad faith, and again he provided evidence of that. What concrete evidence have you seen that it came from nature (other than the Nature article which has been ripped to shreds)?
Full context on what Dr. Ron Paul said:
Just a week or so ago the mainstream media and thousands representing the “medical community” told us we must throw out the “stay-at-home” orders and go to the streets to protest the death of George Floyd at the hands of the police. The Covid-19 virus will not bother people who are protesting this injustice, they said. The virus only attacks people leaving their homes to protest the stay-at-home orders.
Now, after thousands of businesses – many of them black-owned – have been reduced to rubble and innocent people in the inner cities no longer have anywhere to shop for the basic necessities of life, the mainstream media has backed off of its non-stop coverage of the protests. Suddenly last week they all simultaneously embraced a new fear story to terrify the masses: a “second wave” of coronavirus was among us. It was targeting those states that dared to “open up” their economies and begin a return to relatively normal lives.
Texas, Florida and California were singled out to scare the rest of the country into thinking that if you dare leave your homes you will catch coronavirus and die. There was a “spike” in coronavirus “cases” they claimed. Funny, just a month or so ago they were demanding that we massively increase testing, which would produce just that “spike” in coronavirus cases they are now using to scare authorities into reinstating the incredibly destructive stay-at-home orders.
In the county here in Texas that includes Houston, the young judge who somehow seized the power to shut down the third largest city in the United States warns us that she may again shut down Harris County to fight this “second wave” of cases. She even threatened to again pour millions of dollars into a “field hospital” at a Houston football stadium that did not see a single patient in the “first wave” of coronavirus. It’s hard not to wonder which politically-connected companies are reaping millions in contracts for an obviously un-needed hospital. Thousands of hospital beds in Houston are vacant, while cancer patients have been refused their screenings and desperately needed treatments.
As former Congressman David Stockman points out, the actual coronavirus numbers do not in any way support the media assertion that a “second wave” of infection is cresting over Texas. Stockman informs us that in Texas the “reported infected case rate of 256 per 100,000 is just 10 percent of the real ‘hot spot’ rate of 2,477 per 100,000 in the five boroughs of New York City; and its mortality rate of 6.2 per 100,000 population is just 3 percent of New York City’s 196 per 100,000 rate.”
There are no “hot spots” in Texas. It’s just more media hype.
It’s funny that they don’t dare mention Georgia, which has also opened its economy and has seen no “spike” at all.
The same people who were demanding more testing are now screaming that we must shut the economy down again because these tests – which are notoriously unreliable – are showing more coronavirus cases. This is a disease that 99.9 percent of the people who are infected with survive! But 40 million people out of work and the thousands of lives that will end due to the shutdown are never mentioned.
There is something else going on here, and it is in no way related to public health.
It's been awhile since I made a post on the IHME/U of Washington model, since the recent versions hadn't changes a whole lot. However, with this version, they've extended the model through 10/1, showing the start of a second peak, with 145K deaths by August 1st (similar to what it was in mid-May, but an increase over what it was a week or two ago, as per below) and almost 170K deaths by Oct 1st - and implying a lot more after that, based on the significant increase in deaths in September, via the model. NY and NJ modeled deaths have actually decreased a little bit vs. mid-May, meaning the significant increases for the US are coming from other states, which is not a surprise.
http://www.healthdata.org/covid/updates
- From IHME: "Based on the latest available data, cumulative COVID-19 deaths could reach 145,728 (estimate range of 136,633 to 166,185) in the US by August. These cumulative estimates are higher than those found in the June 5 release (140,496 deaths, with an estimate range of 134,395 to 146,999) and the May 29 release (135,109 deaths, with an estimate range of 123,344 to 157,715)"
- NY and NJ modeled deaths have actually decreased a little bit vs. mid-May, with NY projected to reach 32K deaths by 10/1 and NJ expected to reach 13K deaths by 10/1 meaning the significant increases for the US would be coming from other states, which is not a surprise.
- A word about Brazil and Mexico. The model shows an huge increase in deaths in Brazil, bringing it from the current ~37K deaths to over 165K deaths by August 1st. Similarly, Mexico is projected to go from 13K current deaths to 52K deaths by August 1st.
Major jump in projected US deaths in today's IHME/U of Washington model release, from 169K through 10/1/2020 a week ago to 201K now, with most of that increase due to increased projections from FL, CA, GA, AZ, AL, TX, given cases ramping up and deaths starting to (as well as kids going back to school in September presumably). Wasn't clear if they're accounting for improved treatments or not (doubtful, since not iron-clad proof of it yet, just clinical indications of it). Fortunately, NY/NJ projections only went up slightly (by about 1000 each). Still same major concerns over Mexico/Central America and South America as reported in the quoted post.
http://www.healthdata.org/covid/updates
I agree that everyone should use masks indoors. But a mask being comfortable as hell I'm calling complete BS on. There is nothing comfortable about a mask especially for 8-10 hours especially when you are doing some form of physical labor.
Ohio started staged reopening about 3 weeks ago, our new cases have been under 500 per day for the last 18 days out high was a little over 1000 in a day in late april. we are looking pretty much flat on new cases and hospitalizations. they our R0 number is .8
https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/o...14-cases-14-deaths-reported-in-last-24-hours/
https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/o...14-cases-14-deaths-reported-in-last-24-hours/
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Who has gotten anything right in this whole mess? I think I would take anything anybody says on this with a large grain of salt.
Agreed, I’ve seen people exercising with them on and thought “wow that looks awful.” So I tried jogging with mine on to see for myself and soon realized they’re even bigger psychopaths than I originally thought.
I just got done yesterday riding at 6 Mile Run yesterday and saw a biker heading to the trails with a mask on and asked if he really planned on wearing that and he said something but couldn't understand the muffle. When it's cooler out I could see it being possible but mountain biking in the heat with a cover over your mouth has to be unbearable.
Yeah, I agree. I went back and forth on this video because of that. But his message about masks I thought was very strong and needed to be posted.
Yes, Martenson comes with a very large grain of salt and now I am regretting posting the video. That said, he has been far more right than wrong on a lot of things.
As far as the origination of the virus, it is largely agreed upon that it originated in a wet market which would make the most sense. On the other hand, that has not been proven and a virus escaping from a lab (Anthrax) is not w/o precedent. So, it is being a bit rigid to summarily dismiss Martenson for simply asking the question.
But Martenson was wrong on Hydroxi and could be very wrong about this new steroidal treatment. At it's core a steroid makes a lot of sense as an effective treatment because it is an anti-inflammatory.
As far as the origination of the virus, it is largely agreed upon that it originated in a wet market which would make the most sense. On the other hand, that has not been proven and a virus escaping from a lab (Anthrax) is not w/o precedent. So, it is being a bit rigid to summarily dismiss Martenson for simply asking the question.
But Martenson was wrong on Hydroxi and could be very wrong about this new steroidal treatment. At it's core a steroid makes a lot of sense as an effective treatment because it is an anti-inflammatory.
1)June 10th is most likely not up to date, I almost guarantee it. Horowitz said June 3rd has 1 new patient. The other day the graph said 54 for June 3rd. Today it's 59. There is a lag. I'd be very very surprised if June 10th doesn't change.
The day he posted the article the graph showed a down ward trend. 1 new case for June 3rd. As of right now, June 2nd is the highest day for newly hospitalized Covid cases. June 3rd has 59 new cases. That may rise more, June 10th will most certainly rise, June 15th which currently shows 5 cases, will definitely rise.
I'll say it again there is a lag.
2)He says they are discovering more asymptomatic cases in hospitals. Does he have any #'s on this? We know he read the graph on new covid cases, and he provides no data that shows that they are discovering asymptomatic cases amongst patients who are in the hospital for other reasons. And I don't doubt they are, a little, but not significantly, and he provides nothing to show it either way. He's talking out his arse as far as I can see.
I'll say this again too, that article is bunk. Take the drop. Let's move on.
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