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OT: Any Burned Out Teachers in Here?

180 vs 234 avg work days with 7.5hrs vs 10.5 avg hours
that 60k extrapolated out is pretty generous when benefits etc are considered.

I certainly appreciated teaching is different as the parents and kids have changed but so has the teachers. For anyone to say you are burned out by a profession that requires minimal mental exhaustion is somewhat laughable. At the end of the day, the best and brightest do not go into teaching (on average) so perhaps that is the crux of the issue.

a great teacher is worth their weight in gold but it's increasingly difficult to find that great teacher

teaching and LE have lists of people to fill any vacant positions
You speak of mental exhaustion, but maybe we should rephrase to emotional exhaustion. The things we see and deal with take a toll. The situations kids come from/are forced into will rip your heart out.

Your second point is false. There are not teachers out there to fill positions. Many districts have had the same openings for years because no one applies. I'm not only a teacher, but on the BOE, so I know exactly who is applying for which positions. We have started going to college job fairs to recruit kids. They aren't coming to us anymore. We have to go get them before they're snatched up.
 
Honestly sounds like you're exactly the kind of administrator as to why Teachers are leaving
actually, he sounds like the kind you want as he brings realism, accountability, and a focus on attentive learning. Many many teachers are lazy and do the bare minimum while complaining on their way at 3pm oh and all the while the actual teaching part has gotten easier. completely agree that parents attitudes have changed and need to be in check
 
You speak of mental exhaustion, but maybe we should rephrase to emotional exhaustion. The things we see and deal with take a toll. The situations kids come from/are forced into will rip your heart out.

Your second point is false. There are not teachers out there to fill positions. Many districts have had the same openings for years because no one applies. I'm not only a teacher, but on the BOE, so I know exactly who is applying for which positions. We have started going to college job fairs to recruit kids. They aren't coming to us anymore. We have to go get them before they're snatched up.
slow down champ, intimately involved in this for my township and know the state rolls. We could lose 3 tomorrow and have the holes filled by Friday and every neighboring town in Monmouth cnty is the same.

any profession that works 180 days a year with less than 8hrs and 2 mos off, winter, spring, etc etc speaking of exhaustion is laughable. there is no defense of this narrative
 
slow down champ, intimately involved in this for my township and know the state rolls. We could lose 3 tomorrow and have the holes filled by Friday and every neighboring town in Monmouth cnty is the same.

any profession that works 180 days a year with less than 8hrs and 2 mos off, winter, spring, etc etc speaking of exhaustion is laughable. there is no defense of this narrative
You're wrong on both counts. But I'm not going to argue with you about it because I've been down that path and I know how that goes. Anyway, my 26 minute lunch is over, so I've got ot go back to work.
 
slow down champ, intimately involved in this for my township and know the state rolls. We could lose 3 tomorrow and have the holes filled by Friday and every neighboring town in Monmouth cnty is the same.

any profession that works 180 days a year with less than 8hrs and 2 mos off, winter, spring, etc etc speaking of exhaustion is laughable. there is no defense of this narrative
95- you really have some weird takes on life...So- classes may run 6 hours or so- I don't know a single teacher that punches their clock in and out with the students. Most are working late at night grading papers, setting up the next day- continued education, attending school functions, running to staples to buy supplies, etc.

And I am not a teacher- but I do know what type of schedules most of them take- yes, there are some lazy teachers but most work like a CEO.
 
this is the real crime in education and should be heavily scrutinized

Gov Cuomo salary (aside from under the table stuff) was 225K.
Gov Hochul salary is 250K
The district I mentioned with assistants making 225k says 80% of students are "impoverished" (50k is considered county poverty line for 1 person so "poverty" doesn't mean sharecroppers)

English proficiency is 47% and math is 66% (76% graduation rate) and all that is blamed on a lack of money while supe is paid more than governor. Many parents dont read in any language and many get checks (Sec 8 etc) so they don't really focus on costs and just vote "yes" when they vote at all (and many don't).

Things like this are why I tell people "poor" areas get money but a lot of it vanishes in sketchy manner
 
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In the thread on NB, I read it's justified if the police don't want to do their job.

It's not that way for teachers?

Fascinating stuff.

Seems like a big double standard for public employees. Shouldn't everyone have to do their job our tax dollars pay them to do?
 
Gov Cuomo salary (aside from under the table stuff) was 225K.
Gov Hochul salary is 250K
The district I mentioned with assistants making 225k says 80% of students are "impoverished" (50k is considered county poverty line for 1 person so "poverty" doesn't mean sharecroppers)

English proficiency is 47% and math is 66% (76% graduation rate) and all that is blamed on a lack of money while supe is paid more than governor. Many parents dont read in any language and many get checks (Sec 8 etc) so they don't really focus on costs and just vote "yes" when they vote at all (and many don't).

Things like this are why I tell people "poor" areas get money but a lot of it vanishes in sketchy manner
our super was 250 and I find it ridulous. one admin told me flat out (when we couldn't shitcan a principle who showed up drunk to school and was moved to admi side) that it's a jobs program
 
our super was 250 and I find it ridulous. one admin told me flat out (when we couldn't shitcan a principle who showed up drunk to school and was moved to admi side) that it's a jobs program
Two Group V high schools, not sure how many middle and elementary schools + all staff (support and actual teachers)…I can see a decent wage/package for a superintendent for a district like that.

But there is probably some fat to trim. A good amount.
 
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our super was 250 and I find it ridulous. one admin told me flat out (when we couldn't shitcan a principle who showed up drunk to school and was moved to admi side) that it's a jobs program

I don't even know what a good school supe looks like.
I'm sure they exist somewhere but not where I live or grew-up.
I had a neighborhood school growing-up in a town of 4 square miles.
Rain, snow, heat etc we all walked - grew-up in nature.
Then a supe decided we needed the "Princeton Plan" to bus kids around after 1st grade.
The excuse given was that one elementary school was "only" 50% minority while another was 80%.
Then it turned-out the contracted bus co was owned by an in-law.
The contract was the real reason and not the usual smoke screen.

The current supe (Hispanic) has said specifically that he is most interested in the immigrant kids.
His big deal has been "Social and Emotional Learning" (SEL) - which is a branch on the CRT genocide tree (they teach white people are "born bad" and can't be fixed - everyone else is innocent and cant be bad).

Even "good schools" have to follow the garbage that comes from state and fed govs.
People lament school time students missed because of CV-19 but I think it probably helped kids miss on some brainwashing
 
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our super was 250 and I find it ridulous. one admin told me flat out (when we couldn't shitcan a principle who showed up drunk to school and was moved to admi side) that it's a jobs program
My wife’s former school’s superintendent (one k-8 school under his supervision) makes $280k. He’s had nearly 90% turnover in the last 3 years. Multiple employment suits, intimidation hearings, etc. In a normal business world he’d have been canned ten times over, but the board loves him so he stays. Very happy that she was able to move on.
 
Two Group V high schools, not sure how many middle and elementary schools + all staff (support and actual teachers)…I can see a decent wage/package for a superintendent for a district like that.

But there is probably some fat to trim. A good amount.
relative matters

Govenors make that, supers with a 80k pop base should not
 
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I don't even know what a good school supe looks like.
I'm sure they exist somewhere but not where I live or grew-up.
I had a neighborhood school growing-up in a town of 4 square miles.
Rain, snow, heat etc we all walked - grew-up in nature.
Then a supe decided we needed the "Princeton Plan" to bus kids around after 1st grade.
The excuse given was that one elementary school was "only" 50% minority while another was 80%.
Then it turned-out the contracted bus co was owned by an in-law.
The contract was the real reason and not the usual smoke screen.

The current supe (Hispanic) has said specifically that he is most interested in the immigrant kids.
His big deal has been "Social and Emotional Learning" (SEL) - which is a branch on the CRT genocide tree (they teach white people are "born bad" and can't be fixed - everyone else is innocent and cant be bad).

Even "good schools" have to follow the garbage that comes from state and fed govs.
People lament school time students missed because of CV-19 but I think it probably helped kids miss on some brainwashing
the one I mention took me to lunch 2x as he knew that I'd gun for him when I more heavily involved in the schools

to make it worse, he couldn't even tell me where the schools were ranked in the state, the aid budget for each school or the tax allocation, didn't know how many teachers he had under him and more.

utter joke
 
I don't even know what a good school supe looks like.
I'm sure they exist somewhere but not where I live or grew-up.
I had a neighborhood school growing-up in a town of 4 square miles.
Rain, snow, heat etc we all walked - grew-up in nature.
Then a supe decided we needed the "Princeton Plan" to bus kids around after 1st grade.
The excuse given was that one elementary school was "only" 50% minority while another was 80%.
Then it turned-out the contracted bus co was owned by an in-law.
The contract was the real reason and not the usual smoke screen.

The current supe (Hispanic) has said specifically that he is most interested in the immigrant kids.
His big deal has been "Social and Emotional Learning" (SEL) - which is a branch on the CRT genocide tree (they teach white people are "born bad" and can't be fixed - everyone else is innocent and cant be bad).

Even "good schools" have to follow the garbage that comes from state and fed govs.
People lament school time students missed because of CV-19 but I think it probably helped kids miss on some brainwashing
our township is fighting the state on the trans bs now. will be interesting to see how it plays out
 
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I’m a 1 on 1 aide, wife is special education teacher for 34 years. For the both of us this has been the toughest year in education yet. Very hard to get good younger teachers. Don’t get me started on subs. I have had to cover for a music sub that did not speak any English. Also was pulled to cover a gym class because the sub could not watch kickball ( wasn’t the first time kids were playing it). I got to gym class and she was sitting in the stands. Crazy thing is she probably got paid for the day more than I did.

I teach in an elementary school grades 3 thru 6. Can’t tell you the amount of kids that are refusing to go to class. I am the least political guy on this board but will say after these kids stayed home for so long because of COVID they have lost so much…….how to cope, problem solve, social interactions etc etc
 
our township is fighting the state on the trans bs now. will be interesting to see how it plays out
Aside from the psyop aspects, there is also a lot of money in the agit-prop biz.
The usual ninnies fall over themselves hiring "consultants" who talk sweetness and light while sowing piss and vinegar to create divisions.

That was Alinsky's whole bit - don't look like an edgy outsider - gain credibility from the system and then go work in it to cripple it - piss on people and call it rain. That's what they are doing to NYC now. Support criminals while hiding behind "justice" (a tell term to be suspicious of)

"According to Alinsky, the organizer, especially a paid organizer from outside, must first overcome suspicion and establish credibility. Next the organizer must begin the task of agitating: rubbing resentments, fanning hostilities, and searching out controversy. This is necessary to get people to participate. An organizer has to attack apathy and disturb the prevailing patterns of complacent community life where people have simply come to accept a bad situation. Alinsky would say, "The first step in community organization is community disorganization."


Through a process combining hope and resentment, the organizer tries to create a "mass army" that brings in as many recruits as possible from local organizations, churches, services groups, labor unions, corner gangs, and individuals."


There you are. That's why so many kooks come from Harvard - people hear the name and their brains shut down and green light everything.
 
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I’m a 1 on 1 aide, wife is special education teacher for 34 years. For the both of us this has been the toughest year in education yet. Very hard to get good younger teachers. Don’t get me started on subs. I have had to cover for a music sub that did not speak any English. Also was pulled to cover a gym class because the sub could not watch kickball ( wasn’t the first time kids were playing it). I got to gym class and she was sitting in the stands. Crazy thing is she probably got paid for the day more than I did.

I teach in an elementary school grades 3 thru 6. Can’t tell you the amount of kids that are refusing to go to class. I am the least political guy on this board but will say after these kids stayed home for so long because of COVID they have lost so much…….how to cope, problem solve, social interactions etc etc
Staying home during Covid was one aspect but the greater, and more enduring cause is addiction to electronic devices and social media. Kids rarely communicate face to face anymore which severely stunts their social skills and growth.

Additionally they spend far too much time on social media which warps their sense of reality (could say the same for many “adults” on this site, too..😉), and contributes to low self esteem.
 
Not a teacher but worked in a district for a long time. Point Blank Period, it’s the Executives and Administrators who have been the main reasons why BOEs around the state have been in chaos for years. They’re the ones who decide what money goes where into what program. And there’s a certain section who benefits from this and other sections who are harmed by these decisions. Hell, some of the times, it’s the board who gets what the schools don’t.

I’ve been in 3 schools during my time. Yes you have some teachers who are on the Turnpike right after the dismissal bell. The majority of the of the teachers will be here after school working after school programs, extra curricular activities, among other things. Some are here on their own time making sure kids know HTF to do their work. It’s the same during the summer as well. And for some of the crap they have to deal with from within and from elsewhere, they are some of the most underrated, under appreciated, and Underpaid professionals around.

Like I said, the politics from the BOE is disgusting and it’s a shame that this takes away from the kids on many levels. They’re the ones who make schools bad most of the time.
 
Staying home during Covid was one aspect but the greater, and more enduring cause is addiction to electronic devices and social media. Kids rarely communicate face to face anymore which severely stunts their social skills and growth.

Additionally they spend far too much time on social media which warps their sense of reality (could say the same for many “adults” on this site, too..😉), and contributes to low self esteem.
Kids had more time staying home to get addicted or in some cases further addicted to electronic devices, social media
 
95- you really have some weird takes on life...So- classes may run 6 hours or so- I don't know a single teacher that punches their clock in and out with the students. Most are working late at night grading papers, setting up the next day- continued education, attending school functions, running to staples to buy supplies, etc.

And I am not a teacher- but I do know what type of schedules most of them take- yes, there are some lazy teachers but most work like a CEO.
not at all, just well versed in it (seemingly surrounded by them and cops lol)
 
Have a friend that made a career working in two abbot districts. He said the administrators leave him alone and the parents are not up your a$$. He’s at the tail end of his career and loves it.
 
on the topic of superintendents, we have had a few gems here in OC the last few years. The last one scammed the town out of a lot of $$

 
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How about the BOE guy in old bridge that was accused to stealing from the PTA at his kids school last week ? Not sure if he actually resigned yet
 
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Like I said, the politics from the BOE is disgusting and it’s a shame that this takes away from the kids on many levels. They’re the ones who make schools bad most of the time.

That's true - school boards are often the dull knives in the drawer- but they often think they are the sharpest.

The transgender thing was a known and catalogued disorder in the DSM versions. Then small "workgroups" in groups like APA wave a magic wand and the disordered are suddenly better than normal. The people who still know gender dysphoria is disorder are called called "phobic." So up becomes down and down becomes up and that's by design (see Alisnky quote above).

Psychology area is a mess with fake studies. It suffers from a "replication crisis" where studies cant be repeated because they are made up. There are "studies" that make disorders normal. We have a ton of that going on in all spheres.

Now when schools, military etc put disorders as normal and normal as disordered the instigators KNOW a lot of normal people will quit - then more haunted houses get hired. That's part of their transformation model. I was a GA for neo-Marxist prof and my best roomie from uni days is one now. I know their playbook. The radicals from the 60s were all taught to burrow in like ticks and now here we are.

"Subversion (from Latin subvertere 'overthrow') refers to a process by which the values and principles of a system in place are contradicted or reversed in an attempt to transform the established social order and its structures of power, authority, hierarchy, and social norms. Subversion can be described as an attack on the public morale and, "the will to resist intervention are the products of combined political and social or class loyalties which are usually attached to national symbols."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subversion ^^^^^
 
on the topic of superintendents, we have had a few gems here in OC the last few years. The last one scammed the town out of a lot of $$

the boards agree to pay ridiculous monies to these guys. the problem is the boards and their composition. anyway, I'll get annoyed at all of this so will bow out. Got some baseball to watch !!!!!!!!!!!
 
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Our Super in Mahwah was a racist POS...just saying

But, great public school system regardless
Wrote this and it was out of line and I got the position wrong- it wasnt the Super...different person I mixed up with him....deleting the original now.
 
some of them seem to pay pretty good too
A firehose of money is pointed at them. If what you have isn't enough, more can be made available. My MIL worked in an Abbott as a teacher's aide working with the "specialest of the special eds", in her words. My wife grew up attending the same district and she had some interesting stories about all the great stuff they got for free, but that's a different topic. But nonetheless, there's no issue in an Abbott that moar munney cannot somehow fix.
 
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A firehose of money is pointed at them. If what you have isn't enough, more can be made available. My MIL worked in an Abbott as a teacher's aide working with the "specialest of the special eds", in her words. My wife grew up attending the same district and she had some interesting stories about all the great stuff they got for free, but that's a different topic. But nonetheless, there's no issue in an Abbott that moar munney cannot somehow fix.

aint that the truth! 1.25 BILLION for Newark schools that have less than 10% of the kids passing

 
95- you really have some weird takes on life...So- classes may run 6 hours or so- I don't know a single teacher that punches their clock in and out with the students. Most are working late at night grading papers, setting up the next day- continued education, attending school functions, running to staples to buy supplies, etc.

And I am not a teacher- but I do know what type of schedules most of them take- yes, there are some lazy teachers but most work like a CEO.
Maybe we can find a realistic, honest, happy medium in this discussion. I don’t believe most teachers run out the door or do nothing after 3. At the same time, they sure as hell aren’t working as hard as an active CEO.
 
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I semi-retired from corporate more than a decade ago. One thing led to another and after some years I have found myself working as a para-teacher beginning a few years ago.

My first hand observations are that teacher burnout is no more common than it is in corporate. What is VERY different is that someone hanging on in a job they can no longer stand just to reach pension eligibility is much much more common in education. In corporate people leave for better/more suitable jobs all the time. In education the (pretty few) unhappy ones linger for years and their bad attitudes are contagious.
 
I semi-retired from corporate more than a decade ago. One thing led to another and after some years I have found myself working as a para-teacher beginning a few years ago.

My first hand observations are that teacher burnout is no more common than it is in corporate. What is VERY different is that someone hanging on in a job they can no longer stand just to reach pension eligibility is much much more common in education. In corporate people leave for better/more suitable jobs all the time. In education the (pretty few) unhappy ones linger for years and their bad attitudes are contagious.
we see this with most public servant jobs- and in the old days of corporate pensions as well. Back in the good old days of IBM before they ever laid anyone off- half their employees were just riding(or hiding) out their final years. It is why they came up with the bridge retirement or whatever they called it. I think once you had 5 years and were at a certain age- you could leave and come back for a final day on the date that get's you your full pension.
 
aint that the truth! 1.25 BILLION for Newark schools that have less than 10% of the kids passing


I'd support that if the additional 11% went towards vouchers to private/parochial schools. That would also mean smaller class size in Newark's public schools.
 
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aint that the truth! 1.25 BILLION for Newark schools that have less than 10% of the kids passing

WOW 10%!!! , it's a good thing the Newark schools stayed closed longer and set those kids back even further than anybody during 2020-2021 debacle to keep those kids "SAFE"!! LOL!!
 
Salary.com makes some of the pay I'm reading here look a little off base
>How much does a Public School Teacher make in New Jersey? The average Public School Teacher salary in New Jersey is $63,510 as of March 26, 2024, but the range typically falls between $53,024 and $77,477. Salary ranges can vary widely depending on the city and many other important factors, including education, certifications, additional skills, the number of years you have spent in your profession.<
https://www.salary.com/research/salary/benchmark/public-school-teacher-salary/nj

How much does a Teacher make in New Jersey?​


As of Apr 9, 2024, the average annual pay for a Teacher in New Jersey is $43,214 a year. Just in case you need a simple salary calculator, that works out to be approximately $20.78 an hour. This is the equivalent of $831/week or $3,601/month.

While ZipRecruiter is seeing salaries as high as $70,558 and as low as $21,320, the majority of Teacher salaries currently range between $34,000 (25th percentile) to $57,900 (75th percentile) with top earners (90th percentile) making $64,467 annually in New Jersey.
https://www.ziprecruiter.com/Salaries/Teacher-Salary--in-New-Jersey
 
My wife’s former school’s superintendent (one k-8 school under his supervision) makes $280k. He’s had nearly 90% turnover in the last 3 years. Multiple employment suits, intimidation hearings, etc. In a normal business world he’d have been canned ten times over, but the board loves him so he stays. Very happy that she was able to move on.
That’s where tenure is favorable
My wife needs 7 more years to get to 25

If she got a ahole super, she’d deal w it due to retirement soon but also bc tenure

Fortunately unions and lawsuits work both ways
 
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