OT: Car Argument - "The Perfect Car"

[RU4Real]

Lexus LS460 or the LS460L. Best value luxury sedan IMO which one can pick up at a reasonable price certified used.

Meh.

It's a RWD pig that maxes out at 24 mpg highway. It has no handling reflexes at all and 360 hp isn't enough in a 4400 lb. car.

You can get precisely the same characteristics in a Charger / 300 for half the money.

Actually, a Charger R/T handles better, has more power and weighs a little less.

 

[mal359]

The first-gen Neons and Chrysler cloud cars are the ultimate driving machines. 100% unironic.

 

[RU4Real]

The first-gen Neons and Chrysler cloud cars are the ultimate driving machines. 100% unironic.

There's something wrong with you.

 

[mal359]

There's something wrong with you.

Maybe.

I just have a weird appreciation for cheap shitboxes with a wide availability of parts. Same applies to Civics, Corollas, Sentras, etc.

 

[RU4Real]

Maybe.

I just have a weird appreciation for cheap shitboxes with a wide availability of parts. Same applies to Civics, Corollas, Sentras, etc.

Yeah, that's fine. But they're terrible cars. The Neon and the Cirrus / Stratus played largely in the bankruptcy of the entire corporation. Those cars do nothing well except break.

 

[mal359]

Yeah, that's fine. But they're terrible cars. The Neon and the Cirrus / Stratus played largely in the bankruptcy of the entire corporation. Those cars do nothing well except break.

I drive a 2.4L Breeze. Yeah it's terrible to drive in the summers because the AC broke, but the thing has been mostly okay otherwise.

(Stokholm Syndrom is something else.)

 

[RU4Real]

I drive a 2.4L Breeze. Yeah it's terrible to drive in the summers because the AC broke, but the thing has been mostly okay otherwise.

(Stokholm Syndrom is something else.)

This thread is here to help you.

Get yourself a Volkswagen GTI. Seriously. Do it. Based on what you've been driving, it's right up your alley and the night/day difference will blow your mind.

The GTI is one of the best cars in the world - independent of its categorization. Within its category it is hands-down the best - nothing else is even close.

 

[mal359]

This thread is here to help you.

Get yourself a Volkswagen GTI. Seriously. Do it. Based on what you've been driving, it's right up your alley and the night/day difference will blow your mind.

The GTI is one of the best cars in the world - independent of its categorization. Within its category it is hands-down the best - nothing else is even close.

I drove a buddy's mk4 a while back -- the thing was a blast. Buying a Golf (or something similar) is on the top of my "real adult to-do" list.

In your opinion, are the Diesel Golfs worth it? Or GTI only?

 

[RU4Real]

I drove a buddy's mk4 a while back -- the thing was a blast. Buying a Golf (or something similar) is on the top of my "real adult to-do" list.

In your opinion, are the Diesel Golfs worth it? Or GTI only?

I've heard good things about the Golf diesel, but I'd have to question the overall point.

The GTI gets something close to 34 mpg on the highway. The 1.8 turbo, which is still faster than the diesel, gets more like 36-38 mpg on the highway. How much more do you really need?

And for what it's worth, if you thought the Mk4 was a blast, you really need to revisit the car. The Mk5 (which was what I had) was the first one with the EA388 series engine, i.e. 200+ hp. The Mk6 is up to 220 hp, more if you opt for the performance pack. I haven't driven a Mk6 GTI yet, but I own a car built on the same MQB chassis and the dynamics are amazing.

 

[mildone]

This thread is here to help you.

Get yourself a Volkswagen GTI. Seriously. Do it. Based on what you've been driving, it's right up your alley and the night/day difference will blow your mind.

The GTI is one of the best cars in the world - independent of its categorization. Within its category it is hands-down the best - nothing else is even close.

Meh. VW's have reliability issues and GTI's are slow and bugly.

 

[theRU]

I like the SRX.

It doesn't quite meet the handling criteria, but it's a damn solid vehicle. GM's 3.6 V6 (the most current one) is one of the best engines out there.

Well you need to compromise somewhere. This checks most of the boxes. If you like the srx than you should like this... its lighter, with slightly more space and the updated 3.6 powertrain.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

Haha... No... It misses on a bunch of the base criteria. It's too slow, it doesn't handle well... and the gas mileage isn't that good. Nor would it be a reasonable daily driver.

Nice try, though.

275hp is not slow.

Besides.. you put down all these criteria that clash with eachother. You want a high mpg sporty daily driver and a highway cruiser big enough for long roadtrips and tailgates.

The only solution is to go BIG ENOUGH to satisfy those odd criteria and hope for the best with speed and mileage. Plenty of minivans are daily drivers for people and plenty of them have 250hp or more and share the guts and frames of some of your larger sporty passenger cars. Go drive the beefier versions of the Pacifica, Sedonna or Odyssey and see if they are fast enough for you because half of your criteria is begging for a van of some type.

I suppose the crossovers like the SRX mentioned above might be a better fit handling-wise... but really.. you want it all and the beast does not exist.. nor can it exist. Trade-offs between the differing characteristics in your criteria will force going one way or the other.

I think you just got to ask yourself.. do you want to dread using the vehicle for tailgates or long trips with a full crew.. or do you want to dread commuting with it because it doesn't handle like a sports car. In your shoes I would sacrifice driving it like a sports car because these roads and the traffic around here will just lead to problems for the sports car drivers.

 

[AntiG]

McLaren P1

oh wait, you said affordable...

 

[rurichdog]

Nissan R34 Skyline GT-R

 

[RU4Real]

Meh. VW's have reliability issues and GTI's are slow and bugly.

I put 93k miles on my GTI, my oldest (who is an automotive catastrophe) has 25k miles on her Jetta and put 90k on her Beetle 'vert before that.

Not one trip back to the dealer for any of them. No failures, at all.

"VWs have reliability issues" is false.

As for slow - no, not that either. Ugly, I'll give you.

275hp is not slow.

Horsepower is not speed. And 275 ain't much in a big car, not anymore.

 

[snowboarder]

Summer car
2016 Shelby Gt 350
The rest of the year
2017 Ford Raptor

 

[RU4Real]

Summer car
2016 Shelby Gt 350
The rest of the year
2017 Ford Raptor

I'm jealous of people who have lifetime discounts with ExxonMobil.

 

[RUSK97]

Get the V6 accord. Fulfills everything on that list. You're welcome.

You guys are all out of your minds. The Accord is the best vehicle in the world. It hauls more people than a C-5 Galaxy. It parks in a smaller footprint than a Smart for 2. It out-accelerates a Hellcat. It sips less gasoline than a Tesla. It outcorners a Maclaren F1. It tows more than a Cummins Diesel Ram. It offroads better than a M1A2 Abrams tank. All that and it won't take any maintenance other than an oil change every 2 million miles.

 

[Metropolitans3]

I've heard good things about the Golf diesel, but I'd have to question the overall point.

The GTI gets something close to 34 mpg on the highway. The 1.8 turbo, which is still faster than the diesel, gets more like 36-38 mpg on the highway. How much more do you really need?

And for what it's worth, if you thought the Mk4 was a blast, you really need to revisit the car. The Mk5 (which was what I had) was the first one with the EA388 series engine, i.e. 200+ hp. The Mk6 is up to 220 hp, more if you opt for the performance pack. I haven't driven a Mk6 GTI yet, but I own a car built on the same MQB chassis and the dynamics are amazing.

Solid info, but they are up to MK7. MK6 was 2010-14 in the US. The 220hp is the MK7 with the performance pack.

That said, each model was a huge upgrade in build quality. MK4 to MK6/7 would blow your mind.

 

[rutgersal]

The thread loses all credibility when the thread excludes the Honda Accord. It should just be entitled, "the Volkswagon GTI is the perfect car." Why invite open discussion then exclude a worthy choice. one only need to look at Rutgers parking lots to see that Accords and Camrys are well represented. Volkswagon GTI's not so much.

 

[RU4Real]

The thread loses all credibility when the thread excludes the Honda Accord. It should just be entitled, "the Volkswagon GTI is the perfect car." Why invite open discussion then exclude a worthy choice. one only need to look at Rutgers parking lots to see that Accords and Camrys are well represented. Volkswagon GTI's not so much.

The Accord and Camry are both popular cars.

Neither is a driver's car. The Accord is close, but the Camry's chassis dynamics are nothing short of pathetic.

And you spelled "Volkswagen" wrong.

 

[theRU]

The thread loses all credibility when the thread excludes the Honda Accord. It should just be entitled, "the Volkswagon GTI is the perfect car." Why invite open discussion then exclude a worthy choice. one only need to look at Rutgers parking lots to see that Accords and Camrys are well represented. Volkswagon GTI's not so much.

Aside from the reliability of a honda, what else is appealing about them? i do not understand it.

 

[miketd1]

 

[cicero grimes]

My Dodge Challenger R/T. Comfortable and fast as hell.

 

[RU_Planning]

Chrysler LeBaron convertible.

 

[mildone]

I put 93k miles on my GTI, my oldest (who is an automotive catastrophe) has 25k miles on her Jetta and put 90k on her Beetle 'vert before that.

Not one trip back to the dealer for any of them. No failures, at all.

"VWs have reliability issues" is false.

As for slow - no, not that either. Ugly, I'll give you.

I'm going by Consumer Reports reliability ratings. Which list VW as one of the less reliable brands. Don't kill the messenger.

By slow, I mean that pretty much all the other cars in that category (Suburu WRX, Mazdaspeed 3) are faster than the GTI was, comparing similar model years. OTOH, lots of people who buy them modify them which changes everything.

I have to confess that I have yet to buy a car based on it's appearance. If I buy a Cayman GT4, it will be the first car I've bought where I actually like the way it looks.

At the moment, I'm looking into buying a full size SUV and I'm not really liking anything out there. It's actually kind of depressing.

 

[miketd1]

(ducks)

 

[theRU]

I'm going by Consumer Reports reliability ratings. Which list VW as one of the less reliable brands. Don't kill the messenger.

By slow, I mean that pretty much all the other cars in that category (Suburu WRX, Mazdaspeed 3) are faster than the GTI was, comparing similar model years. OTOH, lots of people who buy them modify them which changes everything.

I have to confess that I have yet to buy a car based on it's appearance. If I buy a Cayman GT4, it will be the first car I've bought where I actually like the way it looks.

At the moment, I'm looking into buying a full size SUV and I'm not really liking anything out there. It's actually kind of depressing.

CR is trash , do yourself a favor and stop referencing them for cars. They are clueless.

 

[Metropolitans3]

The thread loses all credibility when the thread excludes the Honda Accord. It should just be entitled, "the Volkswagon GTI is the perfect car." Why invite open discussion then exclude a worthy choice. one only need to look at Rutgers parking lots to see that Accords and Camrys are well represented. Volkswagon GTI's not so much.

There are many good cars out there that serve a purpose. Go fast, be safe, carry a ton, versatile, off road... you name it. I didn't say that the Accord was a bad car. Reliable, safe, cheap, and with the V6, ok fast. But it doesn't meet the criteria of the question. The best "do everything car". Not great MPG for a slower car, not the greatest interior, it can't fit more than any other sedan, and not the most nimble...

And to the others that said that the GTI was under-powered compared to competitors, they would be right. Still is. But put it on a track with the DSG and you'll be looking at them in the review mirror.

 

[e5fdny]

Chrysler LeBaron convertible.

Gotta be the later version with the pop up headlights...

And NOT the one with the fake wood.

 

[RU_Planning]

Gotta be the later version with the pop up headlights...

And NOT the one with the fake wood.

As long as it was previously owned by Jon Voight (no h).

 

[mal359]

Gotta be the later version with the pop up headlights...

And NOT the one with the fake wood.

There's something about the late-80's/early-90's Chrysler aesthetic that I really like.

 

[RU4Real]

I'm going by Consumer Reports reliability ratings. Which list VW as one of the less reliable brands. Don't kill the messenger.

By slow, I mean that pretty much all the other cars in that category (Suburu WRX, Mazdaspeed 3) are faster than the GTI was, comparing similar model years. OTOH, lots of people who buy them modify them which changes everything.

I have to confess that I have yet to buy a car based on it's appearance. If I buy a Cayman GT4, it will be the first car I've bought where I actually like the way it looks.

At the moment, I'm looking into buying a full size SUV and I'm not really liking anything out there. It's actually kind of depressing.

The Speed3 is no longer a thing.

The GTI doesn't compete directly with the WRX - that's what the Golf R is for. Interestingly, however, C&D is on the record as preferring the straight GTI over the latest WRX, which has failed to mature. In a head to head comparison between the Golf R, the WRX and the Focus R, the Golf R won walking away.

I also like the Cayman. Although for the money I'd have to seriously consider the Jag F. I think it's better looking and may be generally more livable than the Cayman.

Full-sized SUVs are tough these days. The prices have been hyperinflated because everybody suddenly thinks they're cool, again. I recommended this in another thread, but I'll reiterate for you - pass on the "usual suspects" and take a good look at the Durango.

 

[FanuSanu52]

CR is trash , do yourself a favor and stop referencing them for cars. They are clueless.

Consumer Reports Reliability Ratings are based on a survey of actual car owners and their actual experiences over time, much like JD Power's Dependability awards.

 

[theRU]

Consumer Reports Reliability Ratings are based on a survey of actual car owners and their actual experiences over time, much like JD Power's Dependability awards.

Exactly... Would you rather rely on a survey from this board ( or better yet the mainboard) about RU football or would you rather make up your own opinion? I like to make my own opinion with input from experts such as Car and Driver and other who actually know how to drive a car to its limits.

Tell me how CR gets reliability ratings on cars that have been out for 1 year? Its all BS.

 

[FanuSanu52]

The V60 is very cool. I wasn't much of a Volvo fan until the latest generation of their product line - now I am.

As for the Audis, like I said... if my car was available as an estate it would be a clear win. Change nothing else, just make it a wagon.

It really is weird how wildly popular they are in Europe but almost unseen, here.

Agree completely about new Volvos and estates. I don't really get American car tastes in general, and find myself more in line with Europeans.

Circling back to your OP, I'm curious what the five vehicles you'd want to own are.

I can think of a solid quartet for myself:

- A quick, sporty coupe or folding hard top for when driving is all about "driving"

- An overland expedition vehicle (something fairly simple and maneuverable, like a 4x4 with roof tent or pop-top bed. Incidentally, the designs I have in mind would be awesome tailgaters). If they ever made an off-road-capable model with one of these, instead of just a motorbike lift, I might be inclined to go bigger : )

-A regular SUV for single-day trips, either with a lot of gear, some off-road element or both

-A family sedan or van for more civilized trips with a car-full of people

 

[FanuSanu52]

Exactly... Would you rather rely on a survey from this board ( or better yet the mainboard) about RU football or would you rather make up your own opinion? I like to make my own opinion with input from experts such as Car and Driver and other who actually know how to drive a car to its limits.

Tell me how CR gets reliability ratings on cars that have been out for 1 year? Its all BS.

I think all need to be collated to provide any value. Steer (ha PUN!) in the right direction with a combo of pro reviews and owner reviews, then test and drive for yourself. Same thing I'd do with any product.

C&D reviews come from jaded guys who don't actually have to pay for anything they drive (do enough reviews and you don't even need to own a car), test only cars from pristine, factory-tweaked media fleets and push those cars to the absolute limits without worrying about the consequences. Oh yeah, and half the time they're doing that testing in some plush corner of the world that the auto co paid for them to be in, taking the keys a few minutes after walking out of said auto co's schwag room.

So, yeah, I take actual owner reviews about as seriously as those "pro" reviews and think a combination gives actual insight where relying solely on one or the other doesn't.

 

[RU4Real]

Agree completely about new Volvos and estates. I don't really get American car tastes in general, and find myself more in line with Europeans.

Circling back to your OP, I'm curious what the five vehicles you'd want to own are.

I can think of a solid quartet for myself:

- A quick, sporty coupe or folding hard top for when driving is all about "driving"

- An overland expedition vehicle (something fairly simple and maneuverable, like a 4x4 with roof tent or pop-top bed. Incidentally, the designs I have in mind would be awesome tailgaters). If they ever made an off-road-capable model with one of these, instead of just a motorbike lift, I might be inclined to go bigger : )

-A regular SUV for single-day trips, either with a lot of gear, some off-road element or both

-A family sedan or van for more civilized trips with a car-full of people

The Five:

1. Sports Coupe (I'm pretty much over convertibles after a really bizarre thing that happened to my daughter in her late Beetle) for those Sunday morning runs on the twisties. Cayman, F-type, etc. One click down on the budget meter maybe a 'Vette, Mustang GT or Camaro SS.

2. Touring / GT for my own personal long-distance road trips. A5, 435i or similar. Must be AWD. The Lexus RC 350 AWD also rather tickles my fancy.

3. Sedan for outings with family / friends - think Saturday night dinners. A4, A6, A7. One click down on the budget meter, maybe a Charger or 300. Something like that.

4. SUV for obvious SUV stuff. I like the Explorer Sport.

5. Runabout. This is optional, really... but something like a Fiat 500 Abarth for grocery store runs comes to mind.

 

[Mike from MD]

The Five:

1. Sports Coupe (I'm pretty much over convertibles after a really bizarre thing that happened to my daughter in her late Beetle) for those Sunday morning runs on the twisties. Cayman, F-type, etc. One click down on the budget meter maybe a 'Vette, Mustang GT or Camaro SS.

2. Touring / GT for my own personal long-distance road trips. A5, 435i or similar. Must be AWD. The Lexus RC 350 AWD also rather tickles my fancy.

3. Sedan for outings with family / friends - think Saturday night dinners. A4, A6, A7. One click down on the budget meter, maybe a Charger or 300. Something like that.

4. SUV for obvious SUV stuff. I like the Explorer Sport.

5. Runabout. This is optional, really... but something like a Fiat 500 Abarth for grocery store runs comes to mind.

I've been covering these needs for the past dozen years with two vehicles:

• 1999 BMW Z-3 coupe (not an M, but a rock-solid performer). I'm finally getting to really break it in around the canyon roads in CA. It's my daily driver.
• 1996 Ford Bronco - for hauling, beach use and tailgating. I'll buy another big Bronco in a heart beat, especially if a CA vehicle that wasn't tainted by road salt. Current one has the 5L engine. Had another 1996 with the 5.8L engine. Driving range was nearly 400 miles.

Like Mildone lamented - there really isn't a new SUV that piques my interest - at least not one worth spending in excess of $50k.

 

[theRU]

If you needed to choose 2 cars, and two cars only to hit the most check marks:
Performance/Sedan with some luxury elements:

Have my wife drive this for all of our remaining needs. large SUV/ Towing/ Comfortable for long hauls, plush interiors.