OT: Copa America 2016

[RU848789]

If you believe the FIFA rankings we are not better than Ecuador. They are ranked 13, USA 31.

Good "if you believe" qualifier. The Euro power rankings have France #1, while FIFA has France at #17 - while #1 is debatable, having France at #17 is just plain wrong. US - Ecuador is a toss-up, to me, especially with the US at home. As often happens in soccer, might come down to a lucky bounce or two - look what happened to Brazil against Peru.

http://www.fifa.com/fifa-world-ranking/ranking-table/men/index.html

http://www.espnfc.us/european-champ...016-power-rankings-germany-second-spain-third

 

[miketd1]

In a sport where goals are at a premium and scoring isn't frequent I don't know why they don't add replays of goals in general not just goal line stuff. Don't they want to get this stuff right and avoid controversies.

Totally agree here.

From what I've read, the powers that be prefer the game as "pure" as possible.

My solution to "offsides":
If it's too-close-to-call, allow the sideline official to indicate "play-on/advantage". If a goal is scored, the play is reviewed to see if the goal was as a direct result of a player being in an offsides position.

The goal is then either confirmed or overturned.

If overturned, the ball is simply given to the defending goalie for a goal kick.

There you have it: a minimum intrusion of "technology/replay" that results in (hopefully) more offensive, but "fair" soccer.

 

[SirScarlet]

Ecuador will borrow Columbia and Brazil fans to wear yellow at the game

 

[Kbee3]

I didn't see the Peru goal. They are far behind Ecuador in the FIFA rankings FWIW. Stunning that Brazil did not get out of their group, though. Colombia music be pleased. So much for USA vs Brazil in Met Life! I would've preferred facing Peru too but that was out once Ecuador beat Haiti.

I did. The Peruvian guy hit the ball in with his hand.
I guess they can't afford the technology to review key plays like that one.
Listen, I was rooting for Peru....but Brazil was robbed.

 

[SirScarlet]

I did. The Peruvian guy hit the ball in with his hand.
I guess they can't afford the technology to review key plays like that one.
Listen, I was rooting for Peru....but Brazil was robbed.

yeah, that was bad.

 

[dvb91]

I did. The Peruvian guy hit the ball in with his hand.
I guess they can't afford the technology to review key plays like that one.
Listen, I was rooting for Peru....but Brazil was robbed.

Yeah, they were robbed, but they should've never been in that situation. Should've put the game to bed in the first half. Possible that they might've been better off losing the first game to Ecuador (where a legitimate goal that got fumbled into the goal by the Brazil GK was ruled out of play) so that they would've been more gung ho to score in this last game instead of happy enough with a draw.

 

[rutgersguy1]

Totally agree here.

From what I've read, the powers that be prefer the game as "pure" as possible.

My solution to "offsides":
If it's too-close-to-call, allow the sideline official to indicate "play-on/advantage". If a goal is scored, the play is reviewed to see if the goal was as a direct result of a player being in an offsides position.

The goal is then either confirmed or overturned.

If overturned, the ball is simply given to the defending goalie for a goal kick.

There you have it: a minimum intrusion of "technology/replay" that results in (hopefully) more offensive, but "fair" soccer.

In UEFA don't they have a ref at the end line now? That would have even helped. Still not my favorite solution because there's still the human factor but at lesat another set of closer eyes.

We have such modern tech, HD, etc.. use it geez. Yes "pure" means eh it doesn't matter if the call is wrong or right in a sport the whole world is crazy over. Come on now. It's one thing to live with human error when you have no options but you do. It's not like it's intruding on the whole game just on key scoring plays where scoring is so infrequent and at premium that you really should do all you can to get them right.

 

[fischy5000]

technically, you could look at it as---if you take 1pt away from them for the tie that should have been a loss and give them 1pt for this match that should have been a tie they'd end up in the same spot. (although, yes they might have gameplanned differently if they knew they had to win)
I'm still very annoyed that the tech isnt in place to work these situations out in the moment though.

 

[Caliknight]

yeah, that was bad.

Karma for the good goal that Ecuador scored that was disallowed.

 

[RUtrumpet92]

Anyone else watching Mexico v Venezuela? Hugely entertaining first half, great goal by Venezuela foe a 1 0 lead. Mexico should have been awarded a PK for a hand ball on a corner kick but no call. I won't shed any tears for them though, never a fan. If Mexico loses they face Argentina in the quarterfinals. Winner will play winner of USA vs Ecuador.

 

[eckoloco]

Great Venezuelan goal. In regards to the US, we need to freaking beat Ecuador. I'm tired of just getting by and showing up for these tournaments. We need to finish in the top 3 of this tournament. This would also help out confidence so that we can dominate for the rest of the Concacaf qualifiers. Again, tired of showing up. I don't care if the style isn't pretty. We need to utilize our system and freaking win!

 

[RUtrumpet92]

I am not satisfied with a quarterfinals loss. Must beat Ecuador to truly call it a successful tournament. If we then lose to Argentina, well, most teams would.

 

[BigLou]

Question: As tournaments go, where does Copa America stand in stature? Obviously the World Cup is #1, and likely the Euro Cup #2 but not sure if Copa America is #3 or if the Olympics or Confederations Cup fall in. Also, I'm not bringing in and Club tournaments. Thoughts?

 

[eckoloco]

Lou, in terms of International tournaments, the hierarchy is: 1. World Cup, 2. Euro, 3. Copa America, 4. Confederations Cup, 5. Concacaf. I didn't rank the Olympics because I consider that a youth tournament......even though each country gets to bring 3 players above the age of 23. You could probably slot the Champions League slightly above or equal to the Euro Cup if you were looking at big tournaments.

 

[Zak57]

Champs League has the most talent.

 

[LevaosLectures]

Champs League has the most talent.

He's clearly talking about international, not club.

It's Euro and Copa America 1 and 2 and then the other confederations are a wash. Gold CUp (concacaf) is probably worse than Africa Cup and Asia Cup, but better than whatever Oceania has for an international cup.

But remember, you're limited by your confederation, usually. The Copa America is by far the most prestigious tournament that USMNT can play in outside of the World Cup.

 

[Zak57]

He's clearly talking about international, not club.

It's Euro and Copa America 1 and 2 and then the other confederations are a wash. Gold CUp (concacaf) is probably worse than Africa Cup and Asia Cup, but better than whatever Oceania has for an international cup.

But remember, you're limited by your confederation, usually. The Copa America is by far the most prestigious tournament that USMNT can play in outside of the World Cup.

Agreed but I was just putting it out there.

 

[lighty]

If it's too-close-to-call, allow the sideline official to indicate "play-on/advantage". If a goal is scored, the play is reviewed to see if the goal was as a direct result of a player being in an offsides position.

I would love to see something like this put in place.

 

[BigLou]

Agreed but I was just putting it out there.

This leads to another question - to the players, what is more meaningful - the World Cup/ other international tournaments versus playing with their club. Certainly they make their money with the club so does that mean they favor club games over National team games? Is the Champions League or their own league play more important than playing for country?
Probably not a simple answer as it may be different for individual players.

 

[Zak57]

I'd think the majority would say playing for their country is more important to them.

 

[LevaosLectures]

This leads to another question - to the players, what is more meaningful - the World Cup/ other international tournaments versus playing with their club. Certainly they make their money with the club so does that mean they favor club games over National team games? Is the Champions League or their own league play more important than playing for country?
Probably not a simple answer as it may be different for individual players.

I think the players care as much or more about international competition.
I think football fans of big European club teams almost universally would say the opposite. Just my impression though.

 

[miketd1]

If you're a star player, you can pretty much sign up with one of the power teams and have a legit shot at winning a major title at the club level.

On the other hand, if you are a star player for a non-soccer power country (United States, for example), it's tough sledding which would probably make it even more rewarding to win the World Cup on the national level.

 

[Zak57]

In semi related news Brazil fired it's coach since they couldn't advance.

 

[mcbabz]

This leads to another question - to the players, what is more meaningful - the World Cup/ other international tournaments versus playing with their club. Certainly they make their money with the club so does that mean they favor club games over National team games? Is the Champions League or their own league play more important than playing for country?
Probably not a simple answer as it may be different for individual players.

It's all about the World Cup, particularly if you aren't one of the top top top players.

The World Cup is where these guys earn their big time transfers, a big performance on the WC stage they become national heroes, legends and earn the chance for the big pay checks.

I'd put the Euro's maybe on par with Champions League, just because it's only every 4 years, where the Champions League is a yearly event, so it means more to make those rosters and shine (again, unless you are at a smaller club).

 

[Kbee3]

In semi related news Brazil fired it's coach since they couldn't advance.

The weakest Brazilian team I've ever seen.

 

[rutgersguy1]

The weakest Brazilian team I've ever seen.

I don't watch enough soccer but some family members who do said Brazil isn't that good and not nearly up to their usual standards. They don't pay attention to the world rankings but when I said they were 7, they didn't think they were worthy of it.

Dunga being fired isn't a surprise either. I think he was on the hot seat even before the tourney.

 

[Caliknight]

I'd call this Brazil team overrated but it seems few people were even rating them highly. After the last World Cup and now this, Brazilian soccer seems overrated as a whole. Some great players, but collectively, they are missing something.

They seem more focused on playing the flashy Brazilian way than actually winning.

 

[miketd1]

Technically brilliant; tactically woefully disorganized.

They like their defenders to play up, but they don't pick their spots carefully leaving them susceptible to the counter-attack, particularly against teams with speed up the middle (ahem, Germany).

And on offense, they seem far too reliant on Neymar's improvisation than on any specific, focused attack strategy (corner & cross, overlap, switch fields, flood a side, etc.).

That's how they won in the past, but times have changed and they no longer enjoy superior players at most positions like they used to. They still produce world class strikers, but Germany has shown you can overcome that with team speed and organization.

 

[mcbabz]

Brazil use to beat teams just be being on the schedule, teams would fold before the game was even kicked off. Germany showed the rest of the world that Brazil was a VERY beatable team, to do what they did to them IN BRAZIL at a world cup was akin to Rocky making Ivan Drago bleed or Christian Okoye getting lit up by Steve Atwater...neither were ever the same again! ;)

 

[Doctor Worm]

It's a shame that the anticipated USA-Brazil matchup at Met Life did not materialize. This would have been the year to take them down.

 

[NotInRHouse]

Brazil lost in the WC and this year because of no Neymar.

This is opposed to say, Argentina, which has Messi in addition to several players playing in the top level in Europe. There just haven't been as many stars out of Brazil aside from him recently.

 

[mosito]

It's a shame that the anticipated USA-Brazil matchup at Met Life did not materialize. This would have been the year to take them down.

I thought It was a sure thing that it would be USA - Brazil.... had the newest USA jersey and everything....(have a Brazil and Argentina as well)... My sister has a USA jersey as well so I figured we were good. Once it was Colombia - Brazil... i was like damn, well at least I have a Brazil Jersey... And proceeded to Order a Cheap Brazil Jersey on Soccer.com for my sister....

On Sunday night I was like... What the Hell... Colombia Peru.... Bummer...

 

[miketd1]

I thought It was a sure thing that it would be USA - Brazil.... had the newest USA jersey and everything....(have a Brazil and Argentina as well)... My sister has a USA jersey as well so I figured we were good. Once it was Colombia - Brazil... i was like damn, well at least I have a Brazil Jersey... And proceeded to Order a Cheap Brazil Jersey on Soccer.com for my sister....

On Sunday night I was like... What the Hell... Colombia Peru.... Bummer...

Repped for the FCB

 

[RU848789]

Great first half for the US, with a beautiful header by Dempsey for the 1-0 lead. Wood was everywhere, Brooks was great, again (although have to be concerned with his elbow) and Guzan came up huge at the end of the first half with a great save - US had a few bad defensive lapses in the last 10 minutes and could've easily given up a goal or two if Ecuador had executed better. Bedoya also missed a golden opportunity for a 2nd goal, mishitting his shot badly with much of the goal wide open. Still, have to like being up 1-0.

 

[miketd1]

Bedoya face palm

 

[mosito]

That was stressful.... Semis!!!

Although we will be missing 3 players and likely facing Argentina...

 

[RU23]

My wishful lineup for Argentina - go at them, and see what we've got.
Guzan
Yedlin Brooks Cameron Johnson
Bradley
Zusi Nagbe
Zardes Pulisic
Dempsey

I realize it looks funny when I post it but it's supposed to be a 4-3-3 with Bradley sitting in front of the back 4,

 

[RUevolution36]

Without 3 key starters, I feel like we are lambs being led to slaughter in the next round. Without wood, I fear that JK is going to start wondo. Without Jones, I fear that JK will start Beckerman. Without Bedoya, I fear that JK will start zusi...Or move yedlin into midfield and leave besler to get skewered by ADM if he's healthy.

 

[miketd1]

Gonna need to improve wing defense against Argentina...

 

[rutgersguy1]

Good win and great to move to the semifinals. Still need to have some composure though. Jones red was unnecessary just like the couple of yellows for dissent in the last game which will cost us Wood against Argentina.

My "layman's" perspective is the same I thought in the world cup and the past too. US usually fields a team that has great heart and gives great effort. Skills are still lacking. We don't keep possession and give it up too easily and don't have enough possession with purpose. I think we'll have problems moving up beyond our current status until those improve. How that happens in succeeding generations I have no idea.