Holiday tourneys

[RU72]

I'm getting conflicting info on whether there is still a spot at Baha Mar over Thanksgiving. The prevailing view is that Rutgers will not participate. I hope that is inaccurate as I was hopeful. It's a great event. As of today, only Rutgers and Nebraska are not in a holiday event per Jon Rothstein. Looks like:
Champions Classic-Michigan State
Asheville-Maryland
Hall of Fame-Northwestern
Empire Classic-Indiana
Maui-Purdue
Rocket Mortgage-Wisconsin
Atlantis-Michigan
ESPN Classic-Penn State
San Diego-Iowa
Emerald Coast Hawaii-Ohio State

Trying to confirm 2 others with Minnesota and Purdue. I believe Charleston is one.

Let's hope on Baha Mar in 2023 or 2024.
Jimmy V and CBS Classic at MSG definitely no.

 

[Scarlet Blind]

2023-24 Men’s College Basketball Early Season Tournaments and Exempt Multi-Team Events (MTEs)

A list of the 2023-24 men’s college basketball season’s exempt multiple-team events (MTEs) and non-exempt tournaments, featuring schedule and TV/streaming information.

www.bloggingthebracket.com

 

[Scarlet Shack]

With seton hall and wake forest As power 6 road games , I’m not seeing us playing in a two game tourney anywhere if we are playing in the gavitt game and a MSG game …this is an either/or situation

The schedule will be…

10 home big ten games
10 road big ten game
6 home out of confrence cuocakes
Gavvitt games ar rhe RAC (we last played on the road against DePaul, so our turn for home game
At seton hall
At wake doesn’t

That’s 29 of 31…17 home /12 road ….23 of 29 power five games

If we play in the Bahamas tourney and get a Gavvitt games home game …that means no MSG game .

If we don’t play in the Bahamas tourney …get rhe MSG game and then find a home and home power 6 game that we return the visit in 2024-2025 (when SHU comes to the RAC )

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

You know what a great event is…….

Thanksgiving with the family on Thanksgiving Day at the family dinner table.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

With seton hall and wake forest As power 6 road games , I’m not seeing us playing in a two game tourney anywhere if we are playing in the gavitt game and a MSG game …this is an either/or situation

The schedule will be…

10 home big ten games
10 road big ten game
6 home out of confrence cuocakes
Gavvitt games ar rhe RAC (we last played on the road against DePaul, so our turn for home game
At seton hall
At wake doesn’t

That’s 29 of 31…17 home /12 road ….23 of 29 power five games

If we play in the Bahamas tourney and get a Gavvitt games home game …that means no MSG game .

If we don’t play in the Bahamas tourney …get rhe MSG game and then find a home and home power 6 game that we return the visit in 2024-2025 (when SHU comes to the RAC )

I dont see it mainly because pike doesnt want it. The excuses we keep running for him are getting crazy haha. 12 of the 14 big ten teams are in them. We are the only program in all the big ten and perhaps all of the p6 to not play in one past 7 years. Its pathetic

 

[Mr_Twister]

Given the work and expertise of this year’s Selection Committee, maybe Coach Pikiell expects the Selection Committee to re-think their formula for selecting and seeding the tournament.

 

[RU72]

Given the work and expertise of this year’s Selection Committee, maybe Coach Pikiell expects the Selection Committee to re-think their formula for selecting and seeding the tournament.

There will be another MTE in the window from November 7-13 at the RAC. I expect an HBCU and perhaps a local like Monmouth or Lafayette, but no details. It is important philosophically to get the OOC SOS out of the 300's and into the mid-200's. It is 100% a category which the Committee considers. It is not embedded in the overall schedule metric.

 

[NickRU714]

Good thing everyone started doing backflips over that Carino(?) interview last week.

It’s a much easier to not care about schedule/recruit spectaculation or inside sources until they actually materialize.

 

[RUtrumpet92]

It will be disappointing if 12 of our 13 conference-mates can find a way to schedule an event like these and we don't, again.

 

[Scarlet Blind]

2019-20 Bryant(NEC) Niagara(MAAC) Drexel(CAA)
2020-21 Sacred Heart(NEC) FDU(NEC) Hofstra(CAA)
2021-22 Lehigh(Pat) Merrimack(NEC) NJIT(AEC)
2022-23 Columbia(Ivy) Sacred Heart(NEC) UMass Lowell(AEC)
This is how we have opened the last 4 years.

Maybe we should have a prediction thread on which 3 teams he will pick in this year's exempt home tournament after we wait too long on one of these neutral court tournaments.

It looks like he will pick an NEC team, their headquarters are in Somerset, NJ.
Another team that probably loses a lot of seniors/portal or a young team.
And get a little challenge in the third game.

 

[NewJerseyHawk]

First we need to play Princeton

Then we need to play Gonzaga at MSG or on the road.

Then we have to continue to cater to SHU, because Hobbs has an allegiance there and play them annually.

Now we need to add 2 more Power 5/6 teams in Atlantis or Bahamas every year???

If we just make up our minds and pick ONE item to whine or cry about, maybe it would get done.

We should drop playing Seton Hall, retire the "must play Princeton ", even though playing Princeton does nothing to bring the OOC SOS out of the 300s.....and schedule these holiday events. Then we don't have to worry about playing SHU or Princeton in December, when we have to likely play Michigan State, Indiana or Purdue.....

Pick one item.....if it's truly about the OOC SOS, stop discussing Princeton and end the SHU series.....no one has yet to confirm why playing SHU is more attractive than playing St John's at MSG.....

 

[Bayonnebomber79]

Really sorry to hear we won’t be participating in the Jimmy V. I was really looking forward to that. Thanks RU72 for sharing all your insights with us. It’s greatly appreciated

 

[Scarlet Blind]

These are the OOC numbers the last 7 years,

22-23 313(8-4) includes Hofstra
21-22 293(6-5) includes ND
20-21 290(5-1) includes Clemson, Houston
19-20 333(9-2)
18-19 319(7-3)
17-18 349(10-3)
16-17 340(11-2)
They are not good by any stretch of the imagination, I don't care how "tough" the B1G is year after year.

You have to schedule at least over half of your 11 non conference games against low major teams to be a 300+ ranked schedule statistically speaking.

 

[MiloTalon13]

If we get a high level veteran PG like Fernandes and Cliff returns, with our 2023 recruits - with that Summer trip and the 10 practices that go with it, there will never be a better time to try a pre-B1G tournament than this coming season.
I hope Pike reconsiders or whatever needs to happen does because this is the time

 

[RU_DIO]

I'm looking forward to going to The Battle 4 Atlantis with my family this year. Wish RU was in it.

 

[RU72]

First we need to play Princeton

Then we need to play Gonzaga at MSG or on the road.

Then we have to continue to cater to SHU, because Hobbs has an allegiance there and play them annually.

Now we need to add 2 more Power 5/6 teams in Atlantis or Bahamas every year???

If we just make up our minds and pick ONE item to whine or cry about, maybe it would get done.

We should drop playing Seton Hall, retire the "must play Princeton ", even though playing Princeton does nothing to bring the OOC SOS out of the 300s.....and schedule these holiday events. Then we don't have to worry about playing SHU or Princeton in December, when we have to likely play Michigan State, Indiana or Purdue.....

Pick one item.....if it's truly about the OOC SOS, stop discussing Princeton and end the SHU series.....no one has yet to confirm why playing SHU is more attractive than playing St John's at MSG.....

Those are interesting comments which bear no resemblance to what I posted.I did not editorialize. I posted facts. I would,though trade Seton Hall for St. John's at home and at MSG in a second. That is not close with Pitino at the helm. But Seton Hall is not going away.And Rutgers is never playing Princeton again while Steve is coach. Right,wrong or indifferent. The actual import is simple. Should a Holiday tourney replace the MTE every other year or so? Rutgers will be in the Gavitt and will have a home game.Let's hope that it is one of the top 5 and not Georgetown or DePaul.

 

[MiloTalon13]

Rutgers will be in the Gavitt and will have a home game.Let's hope that it is one of the top 5 and not Georgetown or DePaul.

UConn!
and a Holiday Tournament please - the program is taking a step up - step up the schedule!

 

[NickRU714]

First we need to play Princeton

Then we need to play Gonzaga at MSG or on the road.

Then we have to continue to cater to SHU, because Hobbs has an allegiance there and play them annually.

Now we need to add 2 more Power 5/6 teams in Atlantis or Bahamas every year???

If we just make up our minds and pick ONE item to whine or cry about, maybe it would get done.

We should drop playing Seton Hall, retire the "must play Princeton ", even though playing Princeton does nothing to bring the OOC SOS out of the 300s.....and schedule these holiday events. Then we don't have to worry about playing SHU or Princeton in December, when we have to likely play Michigan State, Indiana or Purdue.....

Pick one item.....if it's truly about the OOC SOS, stop discussing Princeton and end the SHU series.....no one has yet to confirm why playing SHU is more attractive than playing St John's at MSG.....

Can I offer one other proposal in the mix:
Actually win the OOC games

If we keep out exact same OOC schedule as the last two years but don't lose multiple games - aren't we comfortably in the tournament?

Let's have a clean resume first and see what happens before having to make changes.

 

[FinalFourOrBust]

Well we’ll deserve to get snubbed from the tourney again if this is the case. Can’t run and hide all non conference.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Can I offer one other proposal in the mix:
Actually win the OOC games

If we keep out exact same OOC schedule as the last two years but don't lose multiple games - aren't we comfortably in the tournament?

Let's have a clean resume first and see what happens before having to make changes.

People are looking to blame our schedule for not getting in to the tournament. We had too many losses, plain and simple.

You are wrong about the NBA, but you are 100% right here.

 

[FinalFourOrBust]

People are looking to blame our schedule for not getting in to the tournament. We had too many losses, plain and simple.

You are wrong about the NBA, but you are 100% right here.

The committee literally said that our OOC schedule was one of the big reasons we didn’t get in. This isn’t some conspiracy theory. Time to get your head out of the sand.

 

[MiloTalon13]

The committee literally said that our OOC schedule was one of the big reasons we didn’t get in. This isn’t some conspiracy theory. Time to get your head out of the sand.

That was given our wins and losses
Win the games we should have won - Temple, SHU, Minnesota, Nebraska and we're in regarless of OOC SOS.

Having said that, this is a different team and entering a new era for Rutgers hoops - time to change things up (plus summer trip w/10 practices - we can be ready).

 

[Scarlet Blind]

Can I offer one other proposal in the mix:
Actually win the OOC games

If we keep out exact same OOC schedule as the last two years but don't lose multiple games - aren't we comfortably in the tournament?

Let's have a clean resume first and see what happens before having to make changes.

The problem with that thinking is results say other wise

2016-17 (11-2) vs 9-23, @ 9-23, 10-23, 8-22, 9-23, L @ 21-12(ACC), 14-16(MEAC), 6-23, 18-14(AEC), 11-19, 13-19, L @ 21-12(BE) earns you 340th SOS vs bottom rung conferences opponents and last place teams in mid major conferences. This has been a pattern for 7 years even after we are a more competitive team that can handle a tougher schedule. Last four years are still 333 290 293 and 313. There is no benefit of beating 6 teams in the bottom 60 of college basketball every year.

 

[bitnez]

This is annoying to me. There’s no reason not to play these tournaments. But it’s Pikes hill to die on. I think he will never do them because he wants to give his guys the time off to be with family. It’s noble but it hurts the perception of the program.

 

[NickRU714]

The committee literally said that our OOC schedule was one of the big reasons we didn’t get in. This isn’t some conspiracy theory. Time to get your head out of the sand.

Because we lost in our OOC schedule.
You can't have a bad OOC schedule and also lose.

If we go 21-13 (10-10) then we are out of the tournament?
Beat SHU and Temple.

Say we upgrade the OOC and go 18-16 (10-10) - that's better?

 

[FinalFourOrBust]

Because we lost in our OOC schedule.
You can't have a bad OOC schedule and also lose.

If we go 21-13 (10-10) then we are out of the tournament?
Beat SHU and Temple.

Say we upgrade the OOC and go 18-16 (10-10) - that's better?

If that loss to temple was instead to West Virginia we would have made the tournament

 

[FinalFourOrBust]

That was given our wins and losses
Win the games we should have won - Temple, SHU, Minnesota, Nebraska and we're in regarless of OOC SOS.

Having said that, this is a different team and entering a new era for Rutgers hoops - time to change things up (plus summer trip w/10 practices - we can be ready).

It’s an OOC schedule that screws you if you aren’t perfect and doesn’t help you if you are. Real teams don’t schedule that way.

 

[NickRU714]

The problem with that thinking is results say other wise

2016-17 (11-2) vs 9-23, @ 9-23, 10-23, 8-22, 9-23, L @ 21-12(ACC), 14-16(MEAC), 6-23, 18-14(AEC), 11-19, 13-19, L @ 21-12(BE) earns you 340th SOS vs bottom rung conferences opponents and last place teams in mid major conferences. This has been a pattern for 7 years even after we are a more competitive team that can handle a tougher schedule. Last four years are still 333 290 293 and 313. There is no benefit of beating 6 teams in the bottom 60 of college basketball every year.

But we aren't beating them. We are losing with a terrible OOC.

22-23: We lost to SHU, Temple, Miami.
21-22: We lost to Layafette and UMass.
20-21: No losses but only 4 game OCC
19-20: We lost to St. Bonaventure and Pitt (13th ACC).

Doesn't matter how much you upgrade if we keep losing to bad teams.

 

[Scarlet Blind]

You can't say say we will automatically lose more if we play a tougher schedule non conference. It might prepare us better for the conference and when the meat of our OOC schedule starts. Have those early cupcakes helped us beat St Bonaventure 19-20 DePaul or UMass 21-22 or Temple 22-23 once?

We struggled with cupcakes in 19-20.. easily beat cupcakes 20-21, struggled with cupcakes 21-22 and blew out cupcakes in 22-23. It hasn't changed whether we beat our first tough opponent only exception was Cuse at home 20-21 by 10

 

[ru66]

I thought we didn't make tourney due to no Mag??

 

[ruinac]

You know what a great event is…….

Thanksgiving with the family on Thanksgiving Day at the family dinner table.

That’s a lame distraction/excuse that Pike puts out. Many of our players come from around the country and world. They aren’t going home on Thanksgiving and back for practice on Friday or Saturday

 

[ruinac]

But we aren't beating them. We are losing with a terrible OOC.

22-23: We lost to SHU, Temple, Miami.
21-22: We lost to Layafette and UMass.
20-21: No losses but only 4 game OCC
19-20: We lost to St. Bonaventure and Pitt (13th ACC).

Doesn't matter how much you upgrade if we keep losing to bad teams.

We are going to lose one or more OOC games every year. An upgraded OOC affords you more opportunities to win meaningful games that counter the losses.

 

[Mr Magoo]

That’s a lame distraction/excuse that Pike puts out. Many of our players come from around the country and world. They aren’t going home on Thanksgiving and back for practice on Friday or Saturday

It would do way more good than harm. Are we the only P5 team to not participate in any?

 

[RUJMM78]

Pikiell knows the Rutgers talent and how difficult it might be to win 10 league games.As such his scheduling strategy is to get as many out of conference wins to make Rutgers a possible bubble NCAA Tournament team.There is a small margin for error because there is no certainty that the offense will score more points next season.There should be no excuses in 2024-25 scheduling because higher level talent will be on the roster.

 

[djrc89]

I agree with the argument that winning what’s on our ooc schedule is enough. The problem, as has been repeated, is that we’ve not succeeded. We seem to beat the patsies at home then go on the road or an empty arena to play teams that we can or should beat, and lose. I feel like playing a team with some moxie at home first would be helpful. It just seems like they beat patsies at home then always struggle

 

[kcg88]

If that loss to temple was instead to West Virginia we would have made the tournament

Merely swapping losses doesn't really matter. Oklahoma State got left out despite a perfectly reasonable OOC schedule (145th) that included a road loss to UConn. That was part of the B12-BE Challenge, so not something they scheduled on their own.

But if you trade their neutral loss against Virginia Tech for a home win over Little Rock then they would have been in the field.

Win the games. Ideally stop scheduling the worst of the worst, and play teams in the 150-250 range and not the 250-350 range. But actually winning is far more important.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

That’s a lame distraction/excuse that Pike puts out. Many of our players come from around the country and world. They aren’t going home on Thanksgiving and back for practice on Friday or Saturday

Guess where those players without a place to go end up on Thanksgiving?

They aren’t sitting in their dorm room.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

It would do way more good than harm. Are we the only P5 team to not participate in any?

I can't find one p6 team that hasn't played in an early season tourney other than RU since pike took over. Can anyone find another school?

 

[ruinac]

Guess where those players without a place to go end up on Thanksgiving?

They aren’t sitting in their dorm room.

Maybe to Pike’s home. Or a teammate’s home. Or out with friends. They’re 20 years old. At that age most of them would be just as happy to share Thanksgiving dinner with the whole team in a destination city. It’s usually the parents who want the college kids home for Thanksgiving. Many kids who I’ve known, who went out of state for college, stopped coming home for Thanksgiving after freshman year.

 

[rubjk]

The committee literally said that our OOC schedule was one of the big reasons we didn’t get in. This isn’t some conspiracy theory. Time to get your head out of the sand.

If we didn’t limp to the finish line we wouldn’t have been snubbed even with the ooc schedule.