I should have specified that point is based off the recruiting industries best standard which is he 247 Sports composite. I can understand your confusion.
Ismael Massoud
- Thread starter MadRU
- Start date
I should have specified that point is based off the recruiting industries best standard which is he 247 Sports composite. I can understand your confusion.
So you're a glass half empty guy?
Out of curiosity, do you consider Texas transfer Jacob Young a recruiting win??
Asking because he's another 3 to 4* national recruit that was in everyone's Top 150 for his class.
If the answer is no, because he wasnt landed out of High school, then I would be curious to know how other schools should count their recruiting rankings for kids that fallout or transfer out of a program.
It has nothing to do with high school or not. My answer is no because he had limited production and was not highly pursued as a transfer by other programs. To “win” in anything other people have to be trying. We don’t have many recuits/transfers that other teams were hoping to have sign on the dotted line up until the minute a verbal was made to Rutgers. Just the way it is.
I think you’re being miserable when it comes to hoops just to be miserable. You can’t possibly think things aren’t on a major uptick.
I don’t get it. Each of Pikiells classes have been botttom third of the conference by average player rating via industry leading 247 composite rankings. He’s finished last in conference twice. This is true and you guys are arguing with me after I said I heard he’s a good coach. You all are sold he can bring this team out of the bottom third of the conference standings with bottom third talent. I’m not. Why is this making people mad? Is there something wrong with thinking bottom third recruiting is not good enough to elevate us out of the bottom third?
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Good night everyone
You refuse to listen. He finished last in the conference with Jordan’s classes. We had about 8 scholarship players at one point last year. Pike is actually building depth. We are recruiting guards who are bigger than the guards who we recruited in the past. We are in the homes of a lot of four star players. Not only that, we are landing some of these four star players. Players are busting their ass on d and actually doing the little things that lead to wins. RU won their first round game back to back seasons in the conference tournament. This year we went to the quarter finals. So while most bottom feeders quit at the end of the season, Pike has his guys amped up and ready to go.
rosojo....what if he is doing the best anyone can given what Rutgers is right now?
Going to have to strongly disagree with that. The endgame results may be similar between football and basketball, but Pikiell has the basketball program in a whole different place from the football program. Under Pikiell, the basketball team has rebounded well and played good defense, which shows that he's a good coach on fundamentals. Consequently, the team was able to pull off a few nice upsets and played some tough teams close (including twice against Michigan State and twice against Purdue). This is what a proper rebuild looks like. Coach up your players on the fundamentals, improve incrementally, and as you win a few more games here and there, your recruiting improves.
With Pikiell, I don't think it's a matter of if he gets it done; it's a matter of when. He's got a plan and he's executing it, and that's not just luck and timing.
For most programs unless you hire a coach with a track record of, not just getting guys to the league, but producing first round picks it is going to take a while to have top half recruiting. In the early stages, what a coach can do is recruit guys who fit how the coach wants his team to play and are high character guys.
Those kinds of guys help lay the foundation for what the program will ultimately become, BUT they're not usually ranked very high. One or two might be "fit/character" guys and be a consensus top-100 prospect, but they'll typically be between 90-100. Good four year guys who develop.
Take Mike White at Florida for instance. He walked into a program with nice facilities, that makes regular appearances in the tournament, has won two nattys and has several guys in the league. But that had nothing to do with him. UF recruits didn't even know who he was when he was hired. It took him four recruiting cycles to land his first five-star prospect. Now he's landed a verbal from his second five-star prospect and should add another in this class soon.
In the meanwhile if the coach is a good motivator and X&O guy, he can lead his team to an upset here and there of ranked teams and further build credibility with recruits. It just takes time. I realize that is easy for me to say because I'm not emotionally attached to Rutgers, but it does take time.
Notice how you needed to reframe to fit your narrative. That's not my confusion, it's yours.
Recruiting at Rutgers has to be measured on what the player ultimately does here, especially with transfers!
If we took all players who have been brought in to program under Pikiell and analyze how they have done so far the results would be underwhelming.
I don’t think that would be all that fair to do though for many reasons.
As I said in another post. Given the cards Pikiell has he appear to be doing a good job recruiting. If I have it right, his strategy of fishing from a pool of quality individuals is the right way and will end up working. Don’t underestimate the value on recruiting trips of guys taking a liking to future teammates.
If we took all players who have been brought in to program under Pikiell and analyze how they have done so far the results would be underwhelming.
I don’t think that would be all that fair to do though for many reasons.
As I said in another post. Given the cards Pikiell has he appear to be doing a good job recruiting. If I have it right, his strategy of fishing from a pool of quality individuals is the right way and will end up working. Don’t underestimate the value on recruiting trips of guys taking a liking to future teammates.
Lol... you didn't spoon feed shit. You're cherry picking stats and ratings that support your narrative. I guess I am too. We're bringing in two 4* kids. Harper committed before he blew up, but then he did blow up. That's a credit to Pikiell, not a knock that he didn't wait for the big boys so he could beat them out and impress you. Mathis had offers from all over and was about to commit to UConn before Pike closed it.
If you didn't wait for the hint of a negative development to start posting about basketball again you'd have more credibility.
This is wrong. Sorry. 247 composite rankings are industry standard. I’m sorry you didn’t know it.
Honestly, if you want to only accept 247 stats, you might as well do it on the 247 board.
When Rice came in, 247 had Seagears as a 4-star .9533 and Jack as a 3-star .9000 - no one site is "industry standard".
The 2018 class, Pikiell’s second class, is ranked 5th in the Big Ten by average stars. Only Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue and Indiana have a higher average star ranking according to Rivals. And that doesn’t include Kiss. 2018 is a terrific infusion of talent at Rutgers. What you believe are the facts that support your position are flat out wrong.
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Moreover Pikiell , unlike Ash, is able to take on and be very competitive with some of the best teams in the Big Ten. For instance , we gave Michigan State all it could handle in the two games we played against them.
Actually industry standard is JD Power and Associates hahaha
Middle of the pack recruiting hopefully will result in at least middle of the pack in the standings. Right now, we would all sign up for that.
Who told you Young wasn't highly pursued as a transfer?? He had at least a half dozen to dozen Power 5 or Big East options available to him??
Do you actually have any idea of what you are talking about or is this something you pull out of the sky??
Young is going to score points and anyone who scores 26 points against any Power 5 team, would get attention. You do realize that he played at Texas and if he was at a smaller school, his numbers would be double or triple??
Then we have schools like Villanova taking 5th year grad transfers from Albany who averaged 19PPG as a 4th year junior...i would probably assume that if Young played at Albany, his stats would be pretty close to 16 to 19PPG as a 4th year junior.
I'm not saying Young walks in as a starter or doesn't have flaws (every player does) you are so far off base or unaware, that it's not even close.
That’s my point. If we had gotten the kid from Albany that would be a win. Young did not have the options you speak of where do you make this stuff up?
Of interest
Tom Konchalski just updated his player ratings
5- (Big time) Major contributor by sophomore season for the average nationally ranked team.
4 - Mid Major) Major contributor by sophomore season for the middle of the road major college.
Adding a + or - to each level increases or reduces the rating slightly.
Paul Mulcahy (4+) 6-5 SW Gill St Bernard NJ - Plays all 84' / Rutgers
Ismael Massoud (4-) 6-7 1/2 SF MacDuffie Schl MA - Frame must bulk to finish plays
Tom Konchalski just updated his player ratings
5- (Big time) Major contributor by sophomore season for the average nationally ranked team.
4 - Mid Major) Major contributor by sophomore season for the middle of the road major college.
Adding a + or - to each level increases or reduces the rating slightly.
Paul Mulcahy (4+) 6-5 SW Gill St Bernard NJ - Plays all 84' / Rutgers
Ismael Massoud (4-) 6-7 1/2 SF MacDuffie Schl MA - Frame must bulk to finish plays
You said average player ranking. 247 does not use average player ranking. 247 uses composite figures. It regularly “grades” a school with 7 recruits as "better" than a team with 4 recruits.
So how are you using the "industry standard" to support your argument being Coach P can't be in the bottom third on 247 as they don't use average player rating?
Rivals actually does allow you to compare using average player ranking and the 2018 class is in the top third, not bottom third of the Big Ten in that metric. And that does not include Kiss.
Want to try again?
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Back on topic. No Massoud verbal yet so thats good news and I think Notre Dame beat WF by alot so the game he went to wasn't anything special. Hope he keeps his visit schedule.
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