COVID-19 Pandemic: Transmissions, Deaths, Treatments, Vaccines, Interventions and More...
- Thread starter Richie O
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Except non-sick people can give it to others and make them sick. If you have been exposed to others who are sick you should be tested.
the fact of the matter is that science has taken a hit through this pandemic...why? because instead of questioning science, some have allowed a pushed narrative including much fake information as with the myocardial study which was just found out today to be phony. Scientific debate went out the window and that should never happen. This thread is a fine example. Notice how the few hardcore doomsday posters in this thread want to resist any other views and insist that they are right and have always been right, some even pontificate facts on opinion with no scientific data to back it up
Believe science ? If non symptomatic people can't spread it, then how come the virus hasn't stopped? Don't sick people stay home especially during a lockdown.
or they are spreading it to others who are asymptomatic
most of the serious infections came when we actually locked people in houses and nursing homes together
Okay so you just admitted that asymptomatic people can spread it. So why shouldn't the asymptomatic people be tested, so they know to stay home and not spread?
how come virus is virusing in place who received accolades for their mask wearing and strict lockdowns
If you are wearing a seatbelt how do you die in a car accident?
A little more clarity on convalescent plasma (CCP) that may confuse some more then help:).
* The Expanded Access Program (EAP) that we have been operating will end on Friday.
* After Friday, all CCP will be labeled as Investigational Use and will require patient consent. EAP or Investigational use did not require the titer to be established. This was initially done because there were limited testing available to determine the level of antibodies. This is being done because there is inventory in the system, but it hasn't been tested with a standard antibody level test.
* Over the next 2-3 months, we will be transitioning to labeling the CCP as Emergency Use (EUA) and will be labeled as either low or high titer as all units that will be used under the EUA will be required to be tested by a specific assay from Ortho that will determine the specific level of antibodies.
* Hospitals that are collecting data on the 70,000 patients that have been treated have been slow to report which has also impacted the reporting of the efficacy data.
Bottom line is CCP is working, however the data collection needs to continue and they are fine-tuning the program by standardized testing and labeling.
* The Expanded Access Program (EAP) that we have been operating will end on Friday.
* After Friday, all CCP will be labeled as Investigational Use and will require patient consent. EAP or Investigational use did not require the titer to be established. This was initially done because there were limited testing available to determine the level of antibodies. This is being done because there is inventory in the system, but it hasn't been tested with a standard antibody level test.
* Over the next 2-3 months, we will be transitioning to labeling the CCP as Emergency Use (EUA) and will be labeled as either low or high titer as all units that will be used under the EUA will be required to be tested by a specific assay from Ortho that will determine the specific level of antibodies.
* Hospitals that are collecting data on the 70,000 patients that have been treated have been slow to report which has also impacted the reporting of the efficacy data.
Bottom line is CCP is working, however the data collection needs to continue and they are fine-tuning the program by standardized testing and labeling.
It's already been explained to you that masks don't stop ALL transmission, and many fools don't wear one.
1. You're definitely nerdy.
2. You're old af, esp. as compared to the wannabe frat bro persona you put forth on the forum.
0-2 fat short guy 2
I'll bet I'm at least 20 years younger than you.
Dork libbies like you I don't associate with
I'll take that bet, and after I win hard, I'll double down on betting you're 20 lbs overweight, guzzler.
Problem is you're broke.
alright, I'll go with 10 years, I'm a young at heart, 38.
We all could be in better shape, with the gyms closed in NJ it's been tough
I had two job interviews so I'm hoping, it sux being outta work, easier to stay up later and have a few extra drinks I guess, lol
these were exactly the two I was reading...I am sure someone here will disparage Professor Balloux and claim they know more than him
This was Trumps first quote on HCQ on March 19th:
THE PRESIDENT: I’d shake his hand, but I’m not supposed to do that. I’d get in a lot of trouble if I did that. But he’s been fantastic. And I thank you, Doctor. He’s going to speak right after I’m finished.
So, Regeneron, again, and — is some — is a company that’s done fantastically well, as I understand, with Ebola and some other things. Great company. And they’re looking at some very promising events also. So you have remdesivir and you have chloroquine and hydro- — hydroxychloroquine. So those are two that are out now, essentially approved for prescribed use.
And I think it’s going to be very exciting. I think it could be a game changer and maybe not. And maybe not. But I think it could be, based on what I see, it could be a game changer. Very powerful. They’re very powerful.
So I want every American to know that we’re doing everything we can. And these actions are important next steps. I mean, for the FDA to act the way they acted, with this kind of speed, is an incredible thing. Normally, they would say, “Well, we could have it by next year” or “We could have it by — in two years from now.” You understand. This is the way — normally, it’s like years and years and years. They had it immediately, based on the fact that it’s been used for other things — totally unrelated things.
He said what you wanted him to say at the beginning but was attached immediately here are the stories from the NY Time and the Washington Post:
This is the NY Time on March 19th.
With Minimal Evidence, Trump Asks F.D.A. to Study Malaria Drugs for Coronavirus
The use of the existing drugs against the new virus is unproven, and some shortages have already been reported.
NY Times on the 20th.
Trump’s Embrace of Unproven Drugs to Treat Coronavirus Defies Science
Doctors and patients also worry that the president’s rosy outlook for the treatments will exacerbate shortages of old malaria drugs relied on by patients with lupus and other debilitating conditions.
Washington Post on the 20th:
Trump Is Overhyping Unproven Coronavirus Drugs
23rd.
As Trump touts an unproven coronavirus treatment, supplies evaporate for patients who need those drugs
There was a massive over reaction to his first statement.
Then Trump being Trump he went all in and here we are.
Posting it a third time doesn't make it any better. As I said when you first posted Doidge's essay, he makes some great points, but misses many points, too, as I said when you first posted this, as per the post below. Since then, a couple of really good articles have come out making, IMO, much stronger cases for why the RCTs for HCQ are more meaningful than especially the very poorly run Raoult and Ford observational studies that so many cite (including Doidge, surprisingly - the Ford study was crap) as proof that HCQ is effective. It's poker night and we might have a Cat 5 hurricane landfall, so I'm done for tonight. Have a read.
Dexamethasone and Hydroxychloroquine: Why Randomized Controlled Trials Matter
What does the best evidence tell us about hydroxychloroquine and dexamethasone?
sciencebasedmedicine.org
Hydroxychloroquine RCTs: 'Ethically, the Choice Is Clear'
The vast majority of studies on hydroxychloroquine and COVID-19 are observational, but randomization is what shows its true effect, says Dr F. Perry Wilson.
www.medscape.com
COVID-19 Pandemic: Transmissions, Deaths, Treatments, Vaccines, Interventions and More...
Well if Gummibear says so that settles it!
rutgers.forums.rivals.com
So we're basically the same age, ha. We might have even gone to HS together.
I shouldn't bust balls on the work thing - cheap shot. Hopefully something pans out.
Are you saying Hawaii is doing well? Hawaii is not doing well especially Oahu... The governor closed it down until around September 15 , 2020... the people are fed up with the double standards of who can open ...who can’t open... no indoor dining again yet water parks and gyms were able to stay open... sorry but they were nearing hospital limits several days ago.
And you wrote about how on the 19th Trump didn’t just opine on the possibilities of HCQ, he ordered it fast-tracked, and on the 21st Trump said it could be the “biggest game changer in the history of medicine” and asked the FDA to “put it into use IMMEDIATELY,” and that perhaps the media was passing judgment on a view of the drug that was being hastened into policy, but you accidentally deleted that part.
Didn't post "it" three times. I posted 3 distinct quotes. Let's agree to disagree. You have a tendency to shout down other posters and to criticize either the authors of studies or the studies themselves if it does not agree with your opinion on HCQ. The jury is still out IMO, and there is ample evidence that HCQ can have efficacy.Posting it a third time doesn't make it any better. As I said when you first posted Doidge's essay, he makes some great points, but misses many points, too, as I said when you first posted this, as per the post below. Since then, a couple of really good articles have come out making, IMO, much stronger cases for why the RCTs for HCQ are more meaningful than especially the very poorly run Raoult and Ford observational studies that so many cite (including Doidge, surprisingly - the Ford study was crap) as proof that HCQ is effective. It's poker night and we might have a Cat 5 hurricane landfall, so I'm done for tonight. Have a read.
Dexamethasone and Hydroxychloroquine: Why Randomized Controlled Trials Matter
What does the best evidence tell us about hydroxychloroquine and dexamethasone?sciencebasedmedicine.org
Hydroxychloroquine RCTs: 'Ethically, the Choice Is Clear'
The vast majority of studies on hydroxychloroquine and COVID-19 are observational, but randomization is what shows its true effect, says Dr F. Perry Wilson.www.medscape.com
COVID-19 Pandemic: Transmissions, Deaths, Treatments, Vaccines, Interventions and More...
Well if Gummibear says so that settles it!
See the tweet from Professor Francois Balloux.
"Many excellent scientists were completely unprepared to deal with the fear and anger the pandemic unleashed, and found it difficult to get their voices heard. "
And on an unrelated topic this (showing that , just like with HCQ, there has been a lot of either one or both biased and really sloppy "science" propounded in the pandemic):
But the studies are mixed... plenty of people are saying they used it and it works..
The other part that I left out was that back in Feb South Korea was recommending Hydrocholoriquine as part of it's treatment protocol and I believe that some Chinese doctors were also recommencing it.
There are some people on this board who point to South Korea as a model of pandemic response.
Here is a report from March 12th.
South Korea experts recommend anti-HIV, anti-malaria drugs for COVID-19 - UPI.com
South Korean disease experts have begun to recommend the use of a combination of antiviral and anti-malaria drugs for patients of the new strain of coronavirus.
www.upi.com
South Korean experts are also recommending the use of hydroxychloroquine in combination with the anti-HIV medication. HCQ is sold under the brand name Plaquenil, among others, and is used for the prevention and treatment of malaria.
Here is a report from Feb.
Seoul recommends use of anti-HIV drug for COVID-19 treatment - Pulse by Maeil Business News Korea
South Korean government endorsed use of Kaletra, a combination of two anti-HIV drugs, to treatment novel coronavirus (COVID-19)-infected patients who are old or severely ill, or have other underlying diseases. The governm
pulsenews.co.kr
All of this is at the beginning of the pandemic. The President sees some evidence of a widely used, cheap and safe (safe being a relative term in the world of drugs) drug that may help stop the spread and asks the FDA to fast track it. I think that's a pretty good decision but because of our fractured culture he is attacked.
Now I believe that since then HCQ has proven not to be as effective but in the early stages this seemed like a good idea.
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You guys are overcomplicating this. Hugh Freeze, and Liberty already figured it out: if you don’t test the players, you don’t have the virus, if you don’t have the virus you don’t have heart issues.
The other part that I left out was that back in Feb South Korea was recommending Hydrocholoriquine as part of it's treatment protocol and I believe that some Chinese doctors were also recommencing it.
There are some people on this board who point to South Korea as a model of pandemic response.
Here is a report from March 12th.
South Korea experts recommend anti-HIV, anti-malaria drugs for COVID-19 - UPI.com
South Korean disease experts have begun to recommend the use of a combination of antiviral and anti-malaria drugs for patients of the new strain of coronavirus.
South Korean experts are also recommending the use of hydroxychloroquine in combination with the anti-HIV medication. HCQ is sold under the brand name Plaquenil, among others, and is used for the prevention and treatment of malaria.
All of this is at the beginning of the pandemic. The President sees some evidence of a widely used, cheap and safe (safe being a relative term in the world of drugs) drug that may help stop the spread and asks the FDA to fast track it. I think that's a pretty good decision but because of our fractured culture he is attacked.
I posted on the CE board back in March that my friend, a doctor in a hospital in a major urban area slammed by the virus, was bullish on HCQ from things he was hearing, and also NJ’s first case, a young-ish male, improved dramatically after going on HCQ—after his American treatment team received advice and guidance from a team of doctors in China; and that was encouraging to me.
None of this anecdotal optimism from March means anything now, and it wasn’t anything more than anecdotal optimism at the time.
The whole HCQ thing has been fascinating to watch. The studies don't seem to show much if any effectiveness, though until a "proper" study with zinc (since everyone seems to think that's important) is done looking at the impact for early stage disease, there will be questions. Maybe that study has been done and I missed it - entirely possible since I haven't been following this stuff as closely as I was a few months ago.
Interestingly one of the biggest proponents of HCQ (Martenson) is now touting a new cure being pushed by a doctor in Australia. Apparently the same guy who came up with the "triple antibiotic" treatment for ulcers, now he has a "triple therapy" for covid which includes ivermectin, zinc and doxycycline. Martenson has been talking about HCQ and ivermectin for months and shows no signs of letting up. It would be nice if that combination is shown to be effective.
Anyway - was wondering if people here have any plans in place in the event you come down with covid? Are you going to ask your doctor for HCQ, just ride it out and hope for the best, or do something else? A couple of months ago I would have been asking for HCQ (though I don't think my doctor would have prescribed it). Now...not so sure. My plan is to follow the EVMS treatment protocol for at home symptomatic patients. That includes vitamin D (already on), quercetin, zinc, vitamin C (current full protocol is in the link below). I don't have any significant risk factors that I'm aware of (not overweight, no diabetes or known heart disease, etc), but am getting up in age (58).
Current EVMS Covid Protocol
Interestingly one of the biggest proponents of HCQ (Martenson) is now touting a new cure being pushed by a doctor in Australia. Apparently the same guy who came up with the "triple antibiotic" treatment for ulcers, now he has a "triple therapy" for covid which includes ivermectin, zinc and doxycycline. Martenson has been talking about HCQ and ivermectin for months and shows no signs of letting up. It would be nice if that combination is shown to be effective.
Anyway - was wondering if people here have any plans in place in the event you come down with covid? Are you going to ask your doctor for HCQ, just ride it out and hope for the best, or do something else? A couple of months ago I would have been asking for HCQ (though I don't think my doctor would have prescribed it). Now...not so sure. My plan is to follow the EVMS treatment protocol for at home symptomatic patients. That includes vitamin D (already on), quercetin, zinc, vitamin C (current full protocol is in the link below). I don't have any significant risk factors that I'm aware of (not overweight, no diabetes or known heart disease, etc), but am getting up in age (58).
Current EVMS Covid Protocol
Cardio exercise has a beneficial immune system effect (so long as you don’t go overboard), and I was running through the pandemic, but currently sidelined with an injury. I feel like this has a mental toll (I can’t run, I’m doing something different than before — now I’m surely in for a bad case!). Mostly hopeful that I already had it.
The South Koreans did what Trump did but nobody was calling the South Korean experts Snake Oil salesmen or critcizing their decision to recommened it as a treatment.
Yes it was for the most part anecdotal but it was early in the Pandemic and wasnt any time to wait for RCTs. Safe Cheap and available give it a shot.
Any many fools wear one incorrectly thinking they are safe and not spreading it! You really are stupid!
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