Recruting misses is 99% responsible. Donner and his personal issues hasn't helped, but even w/o that, he hasn't exactly turned out how we epxected (myself included). And replacing AA is going to be tough next year. Don't have anything in the pipeline close to his caliber.
Match Thread : RU at #3 Iowa, 9pm, BTN TV :
- Thread starter Abro1975
- Start date
Love Ash!!! Lugo no slouch I believe at Endiboro last year or year before best Iowa’s Kemmer.
Did you ever attend a Iowa dual meet in Iowa. Last time there AP and AA only won. AP was winning easily and almost lost. AA had no cake walk either. Just an intimateding place to be.
Iowa only knows one speed forward forward forward. They are relentless when it comes to pushing the action. Plus they get all home town calls.
Why Rider? I'm a graduate of RU NB in 1975. Have seen many wrestling matches at the Barn and RAC , and wrote wrestling for Targum in 1971 and 72, and seen at least a few matches every year since 1971. How many years is that? hmm? let's see....almost 50. Plus been a season ticket holder in Football every year, and season ticket holder for M BB for many of those years, as well as being a big W BB fan since Theresa Grentz made our team great and C Viv continued the run. So again, Why Rider?
Section 113, Row K, Seat 10.
No, but your point was specifically about the $5 million gift, not about anything before it, as if it was the gift that led to our championships. My point is plenty of NCAA champions come from schools that don't have that kind of money. They might not have great or deep overall teams, but great kids comes along and win it all from a lower funded school.
I've never had the pleasure. Don't find myself in Iowa too often (or ever for that matter!).
We have JoJo Aragona coming in....
I was there for a dual meet and BIGs. For obvious reasons. Not a place you put on your vacation schedule. LOL!!!
Of course. That’s where RU is striving to be. They just started up the SKWC not too long ago. It wasn’t funded with a $5 million endowment. I was also referring to the top elite programs that we are wrestling right now...#2 & #3. These are storied programs. RU has a long way to catch up yet. We are trying to close the gap. We have all the pieces just about in place. We are just getting facilities for goodness sakes!! We are working on getting resident athletes and that takes money. Few obstacles, such as cost of living in NJ compared to say State College or midwest.
But, this isn’t about PSU so don’t make this about PSU. Move it along. You mentioned Cael and I said it wasn’t just Cael...PSU saw the BIG picture of what it takes to be ELITE and stay elite on a program level.
Go RU!
Diane
I don’t sugar coat anything. But if you want to be the best you got to wrestle the best. The last two duals we did that. All you so called experts are entitled to your options. Let the season progress. It’s all about getting ready for the BIGS and getting to the NCAAs. Then when all said and done if you don’t like the results complain. I still like our chances with NS and AA. I got a feeling (I keep it to myself there are potential AAs). Never know what happens in March. JMO!!!
A solid recruit no doubt. When I say the caliber of AA, I'm talking about a kid who will be a 4x AA (most likely). Hard to replace those guys.
Sincerely hope JoJo can be that, but I think its premature to say.
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Even a grad school returning NCAA champion in track and a world champion in wrestling couldn’t get it done at RU.
One of the big trainers in jersey said this morning that he feels like kids aren’t progressing in the program . He thought either the team wasn’t focused and partying too much or not enough elite guys to roll around with in the room.
Either way, there are people out there noticing the lack of progress from our guys.
Either way, there are people out there noticing the lack of progress from our guys.
Ok. Ash is 16-0. I guess that’s not progress for big trainers in NJ [eyeroll]
Also, you guys understand that facilities are coming in 2019. We recruited the wrestlers we have to come to wrestle at the Barn. I’m grateful they came here.
Go RU!
Diane
Also, you guys understand that facilities are coming in 2019. We recruited the wrestlers we have to come to wrestle at the Barn. I’m grateful they came here.
Go RU!
Diane
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Besides the state titles... he’s pretty accomplished coming into college... top 10 class recruit... #1 in his weight.. this is as close as it’s going to get
Random observation...but does anyone else find it weird that Van Brill doesn't warm up before his matches? He was sitting on the floor watching Ashnault wrestle when he's up next. Pretty sure I've noticed him do this in other matches too
Definitely the closest we're going to get, but that doesn't mean he's going to "replace" AA right off the bat. I'm not arguing the pedigree, he has a superb track record. But, do you honestly believe he will come in next year and fill AA's shoes in terms of scoring NCAA points and possibly being an NCAA finalist? Chances are very low if we're being truthful.
It was said to me, by the trainer.
And this is a guy who is on board with the program and very pro NJ wrestling.
Look, I’ve been part of program building myself and understand that the plateau stage is difficult and will cause people to question what’s going on. Every program at some point faces the same scenario, and the programs that continually make the best decisions can elevate to become elite programs.
Maybe Rutgers needs to spend a few more years in this current 10-15th rank and build our fan base before taking the next jump? I don’t know .. whatever we do though, we can’t take steps backward!
Thank you, RUReady07. That’s a fair & reasonable assessment. To begin with, I think recruiting with a new facility vs. the Barn basement will be a vast improvement. People forget that hasn’t been the case then expect a miracle in hauling in top recruits. We’ve had the AAs. Maybe consistency in Top 10-15 ranking, more consistency in AA’s and of course, a Natty would really help. I know resident athletes are the #1 priority for recruits. We have the large home fan base the recruits love. Saw a tweet Jo Jo’s father posted that said & I am paraphrasing “can’t wait for my son to wrestle in front of a home crowd like that” referring to the RU/OSU match. RU beat Wisconsin & did pretty well against OSU despite the score (we were in the matches). Iowa showed its prowess against RU but it’s freaking Iowa, our 3rd top ranked match in 8 days. 4th in 13 days if you count Minni. That’s pretty grueling. Good prep for March though. That’s why I’m not discouraged, as long as they stay healthy. Look at Poor Gravina now, so gotta count our blessings!! He didn’t get to wrestle tonight, and I don’t know what’s in store for his final year now. Keep moving onward, keep recruiting and keep fundraising.
Go RU!
Diane
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No way to know for sure bro.. I can only go by trends and observations.... and HS wrestlers are so well prepared today going into college that if ur a top 10 class recruit u most likely have the talent + mental toughness already... I checked the last 5 years of top 10 class recruits and, barring injuries, the vast majority of them went on to AA/contend for titles...the majority of them also went to powerhouse schools..
JoJo shown a lot of improvements this year.. he’s seeking the best competiton, does the extra clubs to improve and from what I seen of wrestlers that jump lvl from JR to SR year they continue that learning curve into college... like High point’s Dave Zabriske or Cassar(I believe, both only won 1 state title their SR year too) so yes, I honestly believe JoJo will contend for AA status right when he competes.
Anyone that had any expectations of Donner isn't paying attention. We don't have a replacement for Ash. Recruiting needs to pickup.
He's been injured or recovering from Surgery all year. Can't judge him just yet.
Name? Club? Initials? Something...
Okay, I'll leave Penn State out of it.
You have two elite wrestlers on your team NOW. And, one of them has just lost two matches in a row and is looking at a potential 6-seed at B1G. That doesn't bode well for nationals and that's not a good look to recruits, even if you would have a $50 million gift and a shiny new bike to show off.
Even when your new facility opens up and you get your RTC funded, your wrestlers are still spending most of their time with the current coaches. And, I'm not sure they're going to get it done. If Ashnault or Suriano win it, it will help, but I still don't think these coaches get you to where you think they will, even with your new toys.
By the way, I would love for Ashnault to win an NC, as long as he doesn't have to go through a guy in blue to get it. A guy persevering and putting himself through that is impressive.
It’s the simple truth and nothing wrong with what you said.
I personally love Goodale, he’s a great guy and has done an incredible job for NJs wrestling program . BUT - that does not mean he gets to hog our program and call it his own forever. The objective is for everyone to do what’s best for the growth of the program , even if it means bringing in higher level coaching. These are the decisions I’m talking about that programs need to make if they want to go from good to great.
*note* Not saying Goodale needs to be replaced, just that there needs to be an honesty with our program where we can clearly make decisions on what is best for us moving forward.
Bingo!
Desanto trains with Lee and Gilman.
I bet Suriano is having 2nd thoughts about coming home....
my two cents,for what its worth....the problem not with just wrestling, but all athletics at this university... RUTGERS. itself...not a brand name when you think of college athletic....tradition and perception means everything when a blue chip recruit is looking to take it to the next level........penn st. has that great tradition, but wasn't getting it done in perhaps the best wrestling state in the country...what did they do? hired a legend as hc, and the rest as they say is history....i posted this question on the fb board,,,would ru win a natty if they hired nick saban as our coach...what i'm really trying to say is a brand name coach with a winning tradition, or university with that same tradition get it done here.....when you think of big time wrestling programs that are hallowed in this country ,only two come to mind....iowa, and okie st.....in fb its nd, ala, mich, o st....not RUTGERS...thats just the way it is...you can't play catch up with tradition you don't have...getting into the big ten was good as far as finances are concerned...but, there was no for sight in how to compete with the bluebloods, and even the lesser blue bloods...just have a chat with some north western alum.
they were the big ten doormat and whipping boy for nearly six decades., and we expect ru to compete with the creme of the crop in what,how many years five, or six.....we all love our st., and st. univ....but lets be real people we may never be a mid level success in the big...we couldn't get it done in the big east, and that other crumby conf, and we expect to shine in the big ten...i guess what i'm trying to say is its okay to be critical of all our teams, and athletes...but, put things in perspective...we are what we are, and all the money in the world wont help if you don.t have the name brand, and blue blood tradition.
they were the big ten doormat and whipping boy for nearly six decades., and we expect ru to compete with the creme of the crop in what,how many years five, or six.....we all love our st., and st. univ....but lets be real people we may never be a mid level success in the big...we couldn't get it done in the big east, and that other crumby conf, and we expect to shine in the big ten...i guess what i'm trying to say is its okay to be critical of all our teams, and athletes...but, put things in perspective...we are what we are, and all the money in the world wont help if you don.t have the name brand, and blue blood tradition.
A slight case of Monday morning quarter-backing. Don't recall anyone really being negative on him when he committed here.
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Agree to disagree I guess. I think he has a a good chance to AA in his career. Just don't see him having the career AA has had.
Thanks for the reasonable response and conversation. I'm not coming over here to pick or troll (usually :smiley:), just calling it like I see it. So, when I see people give money the credit for PSU success, it just needs to be pointed out that the money wasn't the only thing, and might not be the biggest thing.
The question is do you need the RTC, the coaches, the new building and the elite recruits for just one guy to win an NC? And, how long do you give Goodale after all of that other stuff is done to be a long-term elite program. I understand that Goodale brought your program back from the dead, but should that give him a life-long pass?
Pawrestling, my response was about the RU program in general compared to elite, top 5 programs. So, this is my last response to you, because I know how twisting words is an art form and you guys seem to do it for sport to prove a point. I know we have elite wrestlers on R team. I follow R team very closely and appreciate the fact you do as well. Nick lost 2 matches in the regular season in the 2 years he was here. 1 was controversial. It just happens to be in a row. Ash is 16-0 this year so far. Often recruits see the entirety, not just the end result which has yet to be determined. Otherwise, they’d all just only go to Nat Champ teams, no? They can’t take them all! There are other factors recruits want as well, no? Close to home, away from home (a NJ tendency), facilities, resident athletes (who will I wrestle with), relationship/connection with coaches, academics, Olympic aspirations, mentoring, life after wrestling, etc. That’s where we all compete for recruits. RU is catching up quickly on some areas it was severely lacking and it still got those elite recruits. No one wants this more then RU and these athletes. It’s a tremendous amount of pressure.
Also, how much do you pay Cael? PSU, a Public State University, isn’t transparent by PA Law so I can’t find any of those records. That takes m-o-n-e-y. And, he has to pay his assistants handsomely which goes a looooooong way in State College as compared to somewhere like a metropolitan area to live. Money matters is my point.
To NikoRU09’s point, RU is also working with one (both) hand(s) behind its back. We are in the BIG, new to it, up against several blue bloods, with very limited funds to begin with and not fully funded by the BIG. Yet, we are competing and in the Top 10-15 range. Not too shabby. I like the direction where we are and heading...as long as it keeps moving forward. I get impatient at times. I’m a Rutgers’ fan after all. It’s about perspective though.
Go RU!
Diane
Also, how much do you pay Cael? PSU, a Public State University, isn’t transparent by PA Law so I can’t find any of those records. That takes m-o-n-e-y. And, he has to pay his assistants handsomely which goes a looooooong way in State College as compared to somewhere like a metropolitan area to live. Money matters is my point.
To NikoRU09’s point, RU is also working with one (both) hand(s) behind its back. We are in the BIG, new to it, up against several blue bloods, with very limited funds to begin with and not fully funded by the BIG. Yet, we are competing and in the Top 10-15 range. Not too shabby. I like the direction where we are and heading...as long as it keeps moving forward. I get impatient at times. I’m a Rutgers’ fan after all. It’s about perspective though.
Go RU!
Diane
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If Ash gets it this year, or Nick in the next 2 years ... then we may even more elite wrestlers attend RU ... similar to football when Schiano broke the RU doesn’t send players to the NFL argument.
